I am delighted to say that President Obama has supplied me with what to say to students coming to complain about receiving a B+ in my classes – a semi-regular occurrence, in these days of grade inflation. (I have a sneaky feeling that my student evaluations are going to take a nosedive this term, having advised the students that I had allowed the curve to creep up too high in the last couple of years, and that I intended to “take the liquidity out of the Anderson grading supply.” I explained this in great detail in the first week of class, when there was still time to drop, and even earlier in a pre-enrollment memo, but clearly not everyone believed it.) However, if Professor Obama awards himself a B+ for his first year, how can my students not be pleased with one from Professor Anderson for their accomplishments this term?
Simon Jester says:
They say that B+ is the new F+!
December 15, 2009, 10:09 pmtheobromophile says:
Prof. Anderson: this could backfire. Those who take a rather negative view of Obama’s first year could point out that they’ve done a better job of fulfilling course requirements than President Obama has done in his office, so an A- or an A is warranted.
December 15, 2009, 10:16 pmSteve2 says:
A curt “Your sniveling is without merit, say something worthwhile or leave my office,” would be more appropriate. Whining about a B+? Their shame should be monumental.
And kudos to you for fighting against undeservedly high grades. Credit should be given where it’s due, and you’re due credit for working to ensure that no credit is given where it isn’t due.
December 15, 2009, 10:26 pmwilliam jones says:
How absolutely presidential of you.
December 15, 2009, 10:33 pmSteve says:
In my law school we didn’t have pluses, only minuses.
December 15, 2009, 10:34 pmThatGuy says:
12(b)(6) their request for grade inflation and go to lunch.
December 15, 2009, 11:18 pmMike McDougal says:
They’ll just present matters outside the pleadings. Now you’re stuck with a big pile of exhibits.
December 15, 2009, 11:33 pmPerseus says:
Kudos to you. Even Harvey “C-minus” Mansfield caved in a few years ago and now gives ironic (egregiously inflated) grades.
December 15, 2009, 11:35 pmJT says:
Congratulations! I wouldnt be surprised if your stand cost a few of your students jobs that end up going to more practical students who enrolled with the prof with a bit more liquidity in their grading system.
December 15, 2009, 11:49 pmEzra says:
Surely you’ve considered that the majority of your class likely had a better year (or semester) than the POTUS? If anything, the Presidential B+ has now replaced the Gentleman’s C as the floor for grading decency. If ostentatiously getting just about everything wrong gets you a B+, just think how well you can do if you just get only one or two things right, or even if you are just less ostentatious in your failings. I’d think an A- would be hard to miss these days.
December 15, 2009, 11:53 pmMatthew Bilinsky says:
Ezra, let’s hear a detailed description of what you consider “everything” that the President has gotten wrong. I would love to hear this. Please don’t hold back.
December 16, 2009, 12:05 amnice strategy says:
Is professor Anderson fighting against undeservedly high grades, or just fighting against high grades? He isn’t analyzing the results of assessments already administered, he’s deciding in advance that regardless of the performance of this cohort, the distribution of grades awarded will be lower.
Now, if this is in service of maintaining a distinction between B+ and A- that is consistent over the years, fine. Likewise, if the distinction between grades was not aligned to the right set of content and performance standards, fix it. The current cohort shouldn’t begrudge a previous one a slightly different class. Most teachers try to improve their courses every time they teach, and making grades more fair and transparent (if a little more challenging) is part of improving the course, students will deal with it.
Still, I’m skeptical of any system that has a predetermined shape to the distribution of grades. Every cohort of students is different. Use the curve as tool in service of validity and consistency, not as an end unto itself. Just wanting them to work harder than the last batch, even if they are more talented and you teach better, that could come across as arbitrary. Shouldn’t you make your class harder by making them learn more?
In any case, Obama’s B+, that’s going to be helpful to me, I think, as I have many students headed in that direction. Finals Thurs/Fri :|
December 16, 2009, 12:10 amEzra says:
There are far better lists out there than I can concoct on the spur of the moment, even if these other lists are, in places, over and/or under inclusive relative to items I might want to include or exclude. What’s relevant is that across the board, he’s performed at an ‘I told you so’ level,’ where the person being quoted this quip was not a fan, and the things he told folks were generally accurate predictions of left wing trainwrecks and the politics of narcissism. If there’s still a discussion going here in the morning, I might rejoin with some piss and vinegar, and a few new stories.
December 16, 2009, 12:21 amJ. Otto Pohl says:
Many of my students seem to think a B+ is the equivalent of an F and an A- is equivalent to a D. Although I am sure that those that I actually do fail would much prefer a B+.
December 16, 2009, 12:53 amMatthew Bilinsky says:
Oh well, another attempt to get one of the President’s critics prone to pithiness and hyperbole to actually support their criticism with substance and another whiff at the plate. Ezra, some piss and vinegar would sure as hell make you more interesting.
December 16, 2009, 2:37 amChris says:
As a TA for two years, I got several complaints about A-s. One of my professors said he had a student complain about an A – he thought he deserved an A+!
December 16, 2009, 3:10 amDavid Nieporent says:
Domestic policy and foreign policy?
December 16, 2009, 5:10 amPersonFromPorlock says:
Let’s not forget space policy.
By giving himself a B+, but only a B+, Mr. Obama has managed to exhibit both false pride and false humility.
December 16, 2009, 5:33 amSebastian the Ibis says:
Have you considered the average GPA all of the students in your class? I had a professor that adjusted his curve for every class to center it on the class average.
I thought this was remarkably fair since it both accounted for the students, and the grading of other professors.
December 16, 2009, 8:49 amdarelf says:
B+ is great fodder
December 16, 2009, 8:50 amRoger the Shrubber says:
Because both you and the President are being silly?
December 16, 2009, 8:57 amLaw Student says:
I benefited back in the day from your generous grading system. Thank you.
December 16, 2009, 9:24 amSueSimp says:
It’s not fair to blame the students for being unhappy with a B+ when, quite literally, their careers could be riding on it.
Not that I think grade inflation should be encouraged. But as someone who has been asked in interviews to “explain” the stray B+ or two on my transcripts, I cringe in sympathy for the students who are unhappy to get one. They’re not sniveling whiners, they’re just worried — blame the system, not the students. Sure, Obama might be content with a B+, but he can afford to be. He already has a job.
December 16, 2009, 9:51 ammike says:
Fair enough, I’m sure the professor didn’t realize grades were so important to students. From now on, all students should be in the top quartile.
December 16, 2009, 10:56 amPragmaticist says:
Years ago when I taught college, after the course was over a student came to see me about his grade of B+. He complained that he deserved a higher grade. I asked him why he deserved a higher grade, to which he responded, “Well you see, I’m an “A” student”. I threw him out of my office.
December 16, 2009, 11:22 amEzra says:
This. I mean, other than fundamentally missing all economic insights because of a willfully ignorant belief in false socialist and Marxist narratives about class struggle and the labor theory of value, and botching foreign policy pretty badly, in other respects he’s continued the worst aspects of W’s Administration. Despite that, some are so caught up in how ‘inspirational’ he is that they can’t stop applauding. And yet, when you think about it, what they’re really doing is applauding themselves for being the kind of person who supports the kind of person he’s said to be, rather than honestly seeing him for who he is and what he does.
December 16, 2009, 11:27 amtheobromophile says:
If B+ grades are bad, then what on earth is excellent? What type of grade would show that the student has distinguished himself? How does one differentiate the top handful of students from the top quartile?
No matter what, people are going to want some metric by which to determine who the top students are. One of the many problems with law school is that there are only a handful of metrics – grades, quality of school (mostly determined by UGPA and LSAT score, neither one of which are great predictors of legal acumen), and law review membership. While grade inflation presumably makes it easier for students to not suffer under this narrow regime, it will only exacerbate the problem in the long term.
December 16, 2009, 11:39 amBill says:
Woah, they still let you use +/- grades! We were made to drop ours for some stupid reason. Grade inflation remains a nasty problem, but is hidden under the wide bandwidth that is the bulk A,B,C… (D? come on… F? f’getaboutit). C remains the new F (or D if you are a hanger-on to some standards) at the undergrad level, and at the graduate level it’s been that way for ages since you can’t maintain your assistantships with a GPA below 3.0.
As for the stigma of B+ being bullcrap, I agree with “Theo.” Cringe? Pshaw! For me the B+ is an indicator that if such students remember what they got wrong (hey, who seriously looks a the answers they got right on an exam?), they can still become very strong students — maybe even stronger than bored A or A- students.
Plus, I needed that B+/B/B- range to distinguish between otherwise competent, imperfect yet potentially strong undergrads and those who got a “pity B-” from other prof’s prereq courses so they could take and survive a couple of my graduate level classes. Since they are now “all-above-average,” I have to give all of the B Team entry interviews and entry-level assignments. More work for me, and the students B-/B’s (and even the B+’s) have one more thing to complain about, especially when I say “no” (despite saving them from a 3-mo crash-n-burn with “The Baby Eater”).
December 16, 2009, 12:34 pmBill says:
I bet he says that to all the profs… who… uh… gave him Bs.
December 16, 2009, 12:51 pmChrisTS says:
I second Bill.
Even worse is the now-standard question: “Why didn’t I get an A?”
December 16, 2009, 12:55 pmPaul says:
President Obama is a law school grad – just a curiosity question – where would a B+ put him in his class? From what I am reading here it sounds like at least 1/2 the students get A range grades. Perhaps he is saying at least 1/2 the presidents have done better than him in their first year.
December 16, 2009, 1:48 pmIf that is his reasoning it makes sense to me
Tactful says:
Given that every law student — yes, even the transactional types — should master the arts of persuasion and risk analysis, perhaps make a deal with complaining students:
“If you want, I will agree only to reconsider your grade in light of the arguments you make today; you can take your A- and go, or you can agree with me to make this discussion part of your grade. Consider carefully both your reasoning and your audience, and if you still believe your advocacy betters your position, then take the deal. If not, be sure I will take that also into account.”
December 16, 2009, 2:07 pmGuest14 says:
You teach at American, right? A B+ could pretty much sink one of your student’s careers before it even got started, leaving them to struggle with six figure debt and a $45k salary.
Regardless of what they “deserve”, you can’t blame them for trying.
December 16, 2009, 2:37 pmSarcastro says:
[Heh. Just say at least you aren't Prof. Rice.]
December 16, 2009, 5:00 pmegd says:
Oh say it isn’t so, Professor! If this is true, then grade inflation in so-called “top tier” law schools is beyond absurd. Of course, given that where you went to school matters more than your ability to practice law, maybe this isn’t completely silly.
Grades are a measure of one student’s level of achievement against the rest of the class (at least in the cutthroat world of law school). If you’re handing out A’s like candy, then you’re grossly over inflating the curve.
At my alma mater, students were given the grading scale. For first year classes, A’s were to constitute 20-30% (Professor’s discretion) of grades. B’s were 25-35%. C’s 35-45%, and D to F 0-10%. Yes, that meant that at least 35% of students could expect a C+ or worse. Holy cow, a B average!
Fortunately, for 2nd & 3rd year classes, professors were able to give up to 40% of the class A’s and 50% B’s. Seminars were up to 50% A’s & 50% B’s.
I guess that’s the peril of going to a non-T14 school, you don’t get grades just for showing up, instead you have to work for them.
December 16, 2009, 6:11 pmCato The Elder says:
Prof. Anderson, you should read this mini-essay: It changed my personal views by making me understand that this problem is tougher than many make it out be.
December 17, 2009, 7:26 am