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	<title>Comments on: The Climate Change Fund as the New Millennium Development Goals?</title>
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	<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/</link>
	<description>Commentary on law, public policy, and more</description>
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		<title>By: Spinoneone</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709757</link>
		<dc:creator>Spinoneone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 09:14:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709757</guid>
		<description>The AGW hypocrisy is a religion.  It stopped being science when Mann, Trebartha, et al decided to fudge the numbers and destroy the originals.  The Russians are now publishing proof that the numbers used by CRU/EAU, NASA, NOAA, and the UNIPCC were and always have been garbage.

This is now about how the UN can install a Neo-World government, perhaps with Obama the new &quot;President.&quot;  Remember that the EU also started small, as the European Iron and Steel Community of six nations in the mid-1950s.  We need to find a new &quot;Agent Orange&quot; to kill this seedling before it becomes a behemoth.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The AGW hypocrisy is a religion.  It stopped being science when Mann, Trebartha, et al decided to fudge the numbers and destroy the originals.  The Russians are now publishing proof that the numbers used by CRU/EAU, NASA, NOAA, and the UNIPCC were and always have been garbage.</p>
<p>This is now about how the UN can install a Neo-World government, perhaps with Obama the new &#8220;President.&#8221;  Remember that the EU also started small, as the European Iron and Steel Community of six nations in the mid-1950s.  We need to find a new &#8220;Agent Orange&#8221; to kill this seedling before it becomes a behemoth.</p>
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		<title>By: Bohemond</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709668</link>
		<dc:creator>Bohemond</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 04:30:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709668</guid>
		<description>&quot;Regardless of the speechifying in Copenhagen, this is seen as a transfer from rich to poor.&quot;

I&#039;d say, given Chavez&#039; rant, it&#039;s right there in the speechifying.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Regardless of the speechifying in Copenhagen, this is seen as a transfer from rich to poor.&#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;d say, given Chavez&#8217; rant, it&#8217;s right there in the speechifying.</p>
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		<title>By: algie</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709664</link>
		<dc:creator>algie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 04:26:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709664</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s a claim outstanding in gall
That the UN&#039;s a boon to us all
Their boondoggles and lies
Have just come up snake eyes
And the truth they can only stonewall

....nnnn..&#039;o.o&#039;..uu!u....algie
Illegitimi nOn carborundum</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s a claim outstanding in gall<br />
That the UN&#8217;s a boon to us all<br />
Their boondoggles and lies<br />
Have just come up snake eyes<br />
And the truth they can only stonewall</p>
<p>&#8230;.nnnn..&#8217;o.o&#8217;..uu!u&#8230;.algie<br />
Illegitimi nOn carborundum</p>
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		<title>By: algie</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709646</link>
		<dc:creator>algie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 04:04:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709646</guid>
		<description>With a mendicant view of the world
Imprecations and expletives hurled
So the have-nots do curse
Damn you open your purse
And the &#039;Black Flag&#039; of plunder&#039;s unfurled


....nnnn..&#039;o.o&#039;..uu!u....algie
Illegitimi nOn carborundum</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>With a mendicant view of the world<br />
Imprecations and expletives hurled<br />
So the have-nots do curse<br />
Damn you open your purse<br />
And the &#8216;Black Flag&#8217; of plunder&#8217;s unfurled</p>
<p>&#8230;.nnnn..&#8217;o.o&#8217;..uu!u&#8230;.algie<br />
Illegitimi nOn carborundum</p>
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		<title>By: Marty</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709636</link>
		<dc:creator>Marty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 03:51:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709636</guid>
		<description>Lots of words to say it&#039;s all just a shakedown.

It&#039;s abundantly clear that no one who matters actually believes the AGW stuff, it&#039;s just an excuse to get money and power, with the LDC&#039;s shaking down the DC&#039;s and within the DC&#039;s the political, financial and industrial leadership planning to shake down their entire countries.

AGW is just what Hitchcock called the Maguffin---it&#039;s the thing supposedly being pursued or fought over, but in itself is meaningless---it&#039;s just the excuse on which the author hangs the plot, and anything will do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lots of words to say it&#8217;s all just a shakedown.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s abundantly clear that no one who matters actually believes the AGW stuff, it&#8217;s just an excuse to get money and power, with the LDC&#8217;s shaking down the DC&#8217;s and within the DC&#8217;s the political, financial and industrial leadership planning to shake down their entire countries.</p>
<p>AGW is just what Hitchcock called the Maguffin&#8212;it&#8217;s the thing supposedly being pursued or fought over, but in itself is meaningless&#8212;it&#8217;s just the excuse on which the author hangs the plot, and anything will do.</p>
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		<title>By: Foobarista</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709603</link>
		<dc:creator>Foobarista</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 03:07:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709603</guid>
		<description>The UN is where third world corruption meets a first world budget.

Why do we even bother with it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The UN is where third world corruption meets a first world budget.</p>
<p>Why do we even bother with it?</p>
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		<title>By: Kirk Parker</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709595</link>
		<dc:creator>Kirk Parker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 02:57:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709595</guid>
		<description>Joe T.,

I was with you up until the mention of Amanpour--do you &lt;i&gt;really&lt;/i&gt; think her opinion matters to anyone?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joe T.,</p>
<p>I was with you up until the mention of Amanpour&#8211;do you <i>really</i> think her opinion matters to anyone?</p>
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		<title>By: Joe T. Guest</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709569</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe T. Guest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 02:31:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709569</guid>
		<description>Remarkably naive comments about PKO&#039;s, professor.  

As any US Soldier or Marine who has served on a major PKO can tell you, the reasons they work (i.e. get participation) are 

1) meeting altruism and security interests for the nations with a serious military and a mindset to preserve security (e.g. U.S., Canada, GB, France, Denmark, OZ); 1a) the ability to improve one&#039;s own security and to work some mischief under the guise of behaving well (e.g. Russia); 2) permitting some nations to indulge in only sometimes unhealthy cheap moral vanity along with the appearance of bolstering national prestige via some level of military prowess (France, Canada, Spain); 3) the ability to look strong on defense issues while being permitted an easy job that doesn&#039;t require major loss of blood or treasure while other nations do the fighting (Netherlands used to be this way, but manned up); 4) the ability to earn a seat at the Big Boys&#039; Table on security matters, and maybe win some allies (e.g. Poland, Czech Republic, South American nations); and, most importantly, 5) the ability to subsidize military units, and earn hefty bonus pay (both for the soldiers, and the nation sponsoring them) for an otherwise dangerous class of people, a large and underpaid standing army (e.g. Jordan, Kenya, Pakistan.  

Oh yeah, all that, plus Christiane Amanpour thinks PKOs are the bee&#039;s knees.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Remarkably naive comments about PKO&#8217;s, professor.  </p>
<p>As any US Soldier or Marine who has served on a major PKO can tell you, the reasons they work (i.e. get participation) are </p>
<p>1) meeting altruism and security interests for the nations with a serious military and a mindset to preserve security (e.g. U.S., Canada, GB, France, Denmark, OZ); 1a) the ability to improve one&#8217;s own security and to work some mischief under the guise of behaving well (e.g. Russia); 2) permitting some nations to indulge in only sometimes unhealthy cheap moral vanity along with the appearance of bolstering national prestige via some level of military prowess (France, Canada, Spain); 3) the ability to look strong on defense issues while being permitted an easy job that doesn&#8217;t require major loss of blood or treasure while other nations do the fighting (Netherlands used to be this way, but manned up); 4) the ability to earn a seat at the Big Boys&#8217; Table on security matters, and maybe win some allies (e.g. Poland, Czech Republic, South American nations); and, most importantly, 5) the ability to subsidize military units, and earn hefty bonus pay (both for the soldiers, and the nation sponsoring them) for an otherwise dangerous class of people, a large and underpaid standing army (e.g. Jordan, Kenya, Pakistan.  </p>
<p>Oh yeah, all that, plus Christiane Amanpour thinks PKOs are the bee&#8217;s knees.</p>
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		<title>By: Neo</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709559</link>
		<dc:creator>Neo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 02:19:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709559</guid>
		<description>Frankly, this is now sounding more like a negotiation on setting a World Industrial Plan with climate change as a pretext.  More or less locking in industrial output and market share globally.  Given the the two largest up and coming industrial countries, China and India, are trying to opt out, it seems pointless if at least the underlying pretext has little validity.  It seems that the lackeys at the UN thought they could sucker them in, but these folks are no fools.

I keep trying to imagine what happens as 2nd and 3rd world countries realize that they have been dupped or mislead or just plain negotiated badly.  We are talking trade wars, the likes of which have not occurred in over a century, and that means quite possibly real wars as well.  Using a phony pretext, like AGW, will only make this possible outcome even more likely.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Frankly, this is now sounding more like a negotiation on setting a World Industrial Plan with climate change as a pretext.  More or less locking in industrial output and market share globally.  Given the the two largest up and coming industrial countries, China and India, are trying to opt out, it seems pointless if at least the underlying pretext has little validity.  It seems that the lackeys at the UN thought they could sucker them in, but these folks are no fools.</p>
<p>I keep trying to imagine what happens as 2nd and 3rd world countries realize that they have been dupped or mislead or just plain negotiated badly.  We are talking trade wars, the likes of which have not occurred in over a century, and that means quite possibly real wars as well.  Using a phony pretext, like AGW, will only make this possible outcome even more likely.</p>
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		<title>By: Kirk Parker</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709553</link>
		<dc:creator>Kirk Parker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 02:12:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709553</guid>
		<description>dr kill,

Except that, given the level of competence displayed by the organization, the delegate would probably leap from a first-floor window.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dr kill,</p>
<p>Except that, given the level of competence displayed by the organization, the delegate would probably leap from a first-floor window.</p>
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		<title>By: Fen</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709523</link>
		<dc:creator>Fen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 01:19:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709523</guid>
		<description>UN delegate leaping from the building with an attorney and journalist under each arm.

Remember UN action on Angola?  &quot;Hold on a few more months, Angola, help is on the way!&quot;  They&#039;re still waiting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>UN delegate leaping from the building with an attorney and journalist under each arm.</p>
<p>Remember UN action on Angola?  &#8220;Hold on a few more months, Angola, help is on the way!&#8221;  They&#8217;re still waiting.</p>
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		<title>By: dr kill</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709497</link>
		<dc:creator>dr kill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 00:46:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709497</guid>
		<description>I would only add that a fine gift for Christmas is a UN delegate leaping from the building with an attorney (any attorney) under each arm.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would only add that a fine gift for Christmas is a UN delegate leaping from the building with an attorney (any attorney) under each arm.</p>
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		<title>By: vulgar moralist</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709474</link>
		<dc:creator>vulgar moralist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Dec 2009 00:22:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709474</guid>
		<description>Copenhagen isn&#039;t about development policy - it&#039;s about cultural despair. Western leaders essentially are taking the blame for doomsday on their civilization, and non-Western participants see a good opportunity to flog the once-dominant culture while asking for carbon-blood money.

See &quot;Copenhagen and the politics of cultural despair&quot;:

http://vulgarmorality.wordpress.com/2009/12/12/copenhagen-and-the-politics-of-cultural-despair/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Copenhagen isn&#8217;t about development policy &#8211; it&#8217;s about cultural despair. Western leaders essentially are taking the blame for doomsday on their civilization, and non-Western participants see a good opportunity to flog the once-dominant culture while asking for carbon-blood money.</p>
<p>See &#8220;Copenhagen and the politics of cultural despair&#8221;:</p>
<p><a href="http://vulgarmorality.wordpress.com/2009/12/12/copenhagen-and-the-politics-of-cultural-despair/" rel="nofollow">http://vulgarmorality.wordpress.com/2009/12/12/copenhagen-and-the-politics-of-cultural-despair/</a></p>
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		<title>By: dave</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709459</link>
		<dc:creator>dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 23:55:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709459</guid>
		<description>To expand on Mr. Walstad&#039;s post--

BULLDOZE THE UN BUILDING INTO THE RIVER AND TELL THEM TO BUILD ONE IN SOME OTHER COUNTRY WHERE WE ARE NOT WELCOME AND WON&#039;T BE VISITING.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To expand on Mr. Walstad&#8217;s post&#8211;</p>
<p>BULLDOZE THE UN BUILDING INTO THE RIVER AND TELL THEM TO BUILD ONE IN SOME OTHER COUNTRY WHERE WE ARE NOT WELCOME AND WON&#8217;T BE VISITING.</p>
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		<title>By: Instapundit &#187; Blog Archive &#187; KENNETH ANDERSON: The Climate Change Fund as the New Millennium Development Goals?&#8230;</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709438</link>
		<dc:creator>Instapundit &#187; Blog Archive &#187; KENNETH ANDERSON: The Climate Change Fund as the New Millennium Development Goals?&#8230;</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 23:30:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709438</guid>
		<description>[...] KENNETH ANDERSON: The Climate Change Fund as the New Millennium Development Goals? [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] KENNETH ANDERSON: The Climate Change Fund as the New Millennium Development Goals? [...]</p>
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		<title>By: C. Mark Fletcher</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709133</link>
		<dc:creator>C. Mark Fletcher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 18:06:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709133</guid>
		<description>Perhaps achieving the MDGs is not completely altruistic on the part of developed countries but does at least partly represent self interest. Developed countries would benefit from having richer partners to trade with, having to spend less on aid and from technologies created by the newly wealthy countries.

I just noticed that Dan Simon anticipated this thought in his comment...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps achieving the MDGs is not completely altruistic on the part of developed countries but does at least partly represent self interest. Developed countries would benefit from having richer partners to trade with, having to spend less on aid and from technologies created by the newly wealthy countries.</p>
<p>I just noticed that Dan Simon anticipated this thought in his comment&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: East</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-709119</link>
		<dc:creator>East</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 17:56:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-709119</guid>
		<description>MGD is just horrible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MGD is just horrible.</p>
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		<title>By: Allan Walstad</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-708782</link>
		<dc:creator>Allan Walstad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 07:13:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-708782</guid>
		<description>The UN does not merit one tenth the number of mere words expended on it in this post.  US out of the UN, UN out of the US.  It&#039;s really that simple.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The UN does not merit one tenth the number of mere words expended on it in this post.  US out of the UN, UN out of the US.  It&#8217;s really that simple.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Simon</title>
		<link>http://volokh.com/2009/12/16/the-climate-change-fund-as-the-new-millennium-development-goals/comment-page-1/#comment-708777</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Simon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 07:03:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://volokh.com/?p=23576#comment-708777</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t see any significant difference among the interest/altruism balances of peacekeeping, third-world development and climate change mitigation.  All of these involve the developed world ponying up extremely large amounts of cash to fund efforts that directly benefit the developing world, but with very significant indirect benefits to the developed world as well.

The real difference, I would argue, is that decision-makers in the developed world--the ones who decide how much cash to pony up for these efforts--believe that peacekeeping efforts are &lt;em&gt;effective&lt;/em&gt;. They may not actually solve regional crises, but they frequently do provide some friction against the resumption of armed conflicts, and less armed conflict generally means more peace, stability and prosperity for developed countries.  The developed world thus really does reap its share of indirect benefits from its investment.  

On the other hand, none of the folks who hand out checks on behalf of first-world nations believes for an instant that forking over tens of billions of dollars to third-world kleptocrats will somehow miraculously solve the problems of economic backwardness or (if it is indeed a problem) climate change disaster avoidance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t see any significant difference among the interest/altruism balances of peacekeeping, third-world development and climate change mitigation.  All of these involve the developed world ponying up extremely large amounts of cash to fund efforts that directly benefit the developing world, but with very significant indirect benefits to the developed world as well.</p>
<p>The real difference, I would argue, is that decision-makers in the developed world&#8211;the ones who decide how much cash to pony up for these efforts&#8211;believe that peacekeeping efforts are <em>effective</em>. They may not actually solve regional crises, but they frequently do provide some friction against the resumption of armed conflicts, and less armed conflict generally means more peace, stability and prosperity for developed countries.  The developed world thus really does reap its share of indirect benefits from its investment.  </p>
<p>On the other hand, none of the folks who hand out checks on behalf of first-world nations believes for an instant that forking over tens of billions of dollars to third-world kleptocrats will somehow miraculously solve the problems of economic backwardness or (if it is indeed a problem) climate change disaster avoidance.</p>
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