Gold in its pure state:

Has a melting point of 1945 degrees Fahrenheit (1063 degrees Celsius). When alloyed (chemically combined) with other base metals the melting temperature of the resulting alloy is changed. 18K yellow gold has a melting point of 1675 degrees Fahrenheit and 14K yellow gold has a melting point of about 1550 degrees Fahrenheit.

PROPERTIES OF GOLD

ohwilleke:
FWIW, Popular Science’s most current issue determines that dropping the ring in a volcano wouldn’t actually have worked, as magma isn’t actually hot enough to melt a ring (only about 2600 degrees F give or take), and because volcanos tend to eject things that are dropped into them.

Yeah, but did they measure Mount Doom? Anyways, the melting point of gold is less than 2000 degrees F, and it seems like the tendency to eject can be overcome if the volcano is deep enough.

Duffy Pratt: Also, keep in mind that Frodo couldn’t just drop the ring into the volcano. There’s no reason to think he would have had an easier job of it from the back of an eagle.

FWIW, Popular Science’s most current issue determines that dropping the ring in a volcano wouldn’t actually have worked, as magma isn’t actually hot enough to melt a ring (only about 2600 degrees F give or take), and because volcanos tend to eject things that are dropped into them.

Arkady: I recall reading an article on LOTR in which the author said that Tolkein had presented one of the most compelling descriptions of addiction in literature. Gollum, and Frodo, became addicts. In the movie Gollum looked like some of the speed freaks I knew back in the day.

ITA! Substance addiction is precisely the problem here, it simply isn’t an ingested substance that is being addiction.

Then again, an alternate diagnosis of mental illness due to demon possession also has a lot of merit to it and is well established in literature and scripture, if not in the DSM-IV. The facts may be insufficient to distinguish between these two forms of causation, or demon possession may be a mechanism by which the substance addiction acts.

Barry Dauphin: Viggo Mortensen was asked what he thought Lord of the Rings was about. He said it was about how war is not the answer. Discuss amongst yourselves.

It depends on the question.

Duffy Pratt: Also, keep in mind that Frodo couldn’t just drop the ring into the volcano.There’s no reason to think he would have had an easier job of it from the back of an eagle.

That’s why Frodo doesn’t ride on the back of the Eagle, he gets carried in its claws. If Frodo won’t drop the ring, the Eagle drops Frodo and the ring into the volcano.

And if the Eagle hesitates, Gandalf is standing on the tallest tower of Minas Tirith, ready with a lightning bolt to ensure that if necessary, the Eagle falls into the volcano too. Because Gandalf at that point isn’t realistically going to get the ring if he hesitates, he at least is likely to not be tempted :)

TBlakely: I think the comic strip “Dork Tower” first suggested that better planning would have negated the suffering depicted in the books.All the Fellowship had to do was plant Frodo’s butt on a great eagle, have the eagle fly over Mount Doom and then Frodo just tosses the ring in.Funny how the obvious solution evaded the elites in Middle Earth.:P

While I did laugh at that comic, to Tolkien’s credit, that would likely not have worked. Recall that the Nazgul were mounted on flying “fell beasts” after the little incident at the Ford of Bruinen. The eye of Sauron could probably have spotted an eagle flying in at some distance, and send up the Nazgul with sharp pointy things to deal with it (or for that matter, depending on how high the eagles fly, they could have had orc archers deal with them).

Edit: and apparently Sarnac already pointed this out. Good to know I’m not the only LotR geek to think this way.

Gollem’s forensic history is far from limited to Deagol’s murder and the attempted murder of Samwise Gamgee. I don’t have time to check for LoTR page references but I recall that Sméagol was expelled from his native clan of Storrs on suspicion of serial infanticide. Not long after Sméagol stole the Ring from Deagol, Sméagol acquired the practice of using the Ring to kidnap infant children of his own clan of Storrs. These children were taken from their cradles. If memory serves, Sméagol would then strangle and eat the kidnapped infants. This particular behavior would seem to place Gollum beyond the extremes of pedophilia and/or a serial mass murderer. The only historic figure that comes to mind who would seem to be comparable was the predetary homosexual pedophiliac and serial mass murdered of Jewish children (and perhaps significantly) Nobel Peace Prize winner Yassar Arafat.

Gollem’s forensic history is far from limited to Deagol’s murder and the attempted murder of Samwise Gamgee. I don’t have time to check for LoTR page references but I recall that Sméagol was expelled from his native clan of Storrs on suspicion of serial infanticide. Not long after Sméagol stole the Ring from Deagol, Sméagol acquired the practice of using the Ring to kidnap infant children of his own clan of Storrs. These children were taken from their cradles. If memory serves, Sméagol would then strangle and eat the kidnapped infants. This particular behavior would seem to place Gollum beyond the extremes of pedophilia and/or a serial mass murderer. The only historic figure that comes to mind who would seem to be comparable was the predetary homosexual pedophiliac and serial mass murdered of Jewish children (and perhaps significantly) Nobel Peace Prize winner Yassar Arafat.

Regarding the eagle-flight-solution to ring-destruction: any incoming airstrike by the forces-of-light would have been detected by Sauron’s “eye” and the Nazgul airpower available to the forces of darkness could have dispatched the incoming eagles.

Separately, the OneRing could not simply be thrown in to the lava because there was a cave to walk through to get to the interior of Mount Doom. Given a highly-visible incoming airstrike, Mount Doom would have been swarmed by Orcs etc on foot.

The various battles etc were a necessary solution to the problem of distracting a nearly-all-powerful pseudo-deity from trivially blocking the slow-end-run-by-the-pipsqueak.

Sometimes war IS the answer to an otherwise unsolvable problem.

Spending centuries hiding away from others of your own species, in a dark cave, is definitely going to negatively impact your mental health.

But enough about the woes of junior associates in large law firms, eh?

Hey, with the right training and mentoring Gollum could have grown up to be a splendid back office of-counsel patent lawyer (specializing in metallurgy, ‘natch).

And I’m surprised at Prof. Somin. Gollum wasn’t after power or wealth. He was simply trying to protect his property rights. (Sauron was also interested in preserving his property, but for him the ring was a means to an end. For Gollum, it was more of an end in itself.)

I’m also a bit concerned that someone would try to do a psychological profile of Gollum without taking into account the extensive torture he went through at Mordor.

Because we’ve got a world of revelations for you kids. When you’re ready.

Viggo Mortensen was asked what he thought Lord of the Rings was about. He said it was about how war is not the answer. Discuss amongst yourselves.

He’s completely right. It’s about how the answer is throwing a magical ring into a volcano. The war was a sideshow.

Arkady: I recall reading an article on LOTR in which the author said that Tolkein had presented one of the most compelling descriptions of addiction in literature. Gollum, and Frodo, became addicts. In the movie Gollum looked like some of the speed freaks I knew back in the day.

That addictive aspect was the motivation that Andy Serkis used to play the character of Gollum.

But They Helpsss us!

No they hurtsss usss, hurtsss usss sore!”

At least the Gollum personality appears to have been a Scientologist.

Gollum was not “preoccupied” with the One Ring. He was existentially obsessed with it. This is because the Ring was evil- and sentient. Sméagol without the Ring was a quirky, slightly unsocial hobbit-like creature. With it he became Gollum.

I would recommend against trying to cope with evil by using medications or therapy. Or laws, for that matter.

Quite literally, hundreds of years of a life of complete boredom interrupted by moments of terror, with nothing to bring joy except inexpertly prepared sushi. . .

Avatar, I guess you’ve never been an associate at a large firm. I thought something about Tolkien seemed familiar…

GW: Smeagol/Gollum was an Objectivist.

After reading the Orin/Oren thread, I wonder if a certain other G. W. gets objections from his colleagues for your comments.

Sure, Gollum enjoyed an unnaturally prolonged life. But he spent the majority of it in a dank cave, eating raw fish and hiding from goblins. Quite literally, hundreds of years of a life of complete boredom interrupted by moments of terror, with nothing to bring joy except inexpertly prepared sushi and the occasional murder of a savage. I dunno, not a good trade in MY book. The life of a law professor must be REALLY terrible to make that seem attractive!