It would be too tiresome to reply to Brian's Leiter's rant about me point-by-point. So let's just focus on one statement: "But how many times in the last 50 years have 'liberal' politicians and interest groups outside universities successfully mobilized to get someone fired or even threatened that person's tenure because of 'conservative' views?"
Well, let's start with Larry Summers, whom Leiter mentions, oddly enough, in the same post. Sure, Summers is actually a liberal Democrat, but to his leftist critics at Harvard, his views on, among other things, feminism and Israel, were too "conservative" for their taste, and they got him fired from the Harvard presidency. Of course, if Summers were truly and publicly conservative, the odds of him getting the Harvard presidency to begin with would be virtually nil (and the same goes for just about every other leading university).
Which leads to my broader point, that the Left doesn't mobilize against conservatives and libertarians in the universities because they do such a good job at keeping them out to begin with. Let's take law school deanships. Erwin Chemerinsky's job at UC-Irvine was threatened, after it was offered, by outside "conservative" forces. But in the past several years, I've had three calls from colleagues at other law schools about current or former George Mason colleagues who were up for deanships at these schools. In each case, my correspondent noted that there was significant "concern" about the candidates' ideology, such that an entire faculty bloc was opposing the candidate as "too right-wing." None of these candidates got the job.
And then there are the anecdotes that one has personally experienced, that one hears from one's friends, and so forth--do liberals have to pass a quiz about their political views on affirmative action before they get hired? Do liberal international law scholars frequently get negative outside tenure or hiring reviews explicitly based on the premise that their ideas are dangerously left-wing? Do liberals frequently get told that a law school will consider hiring them when one of their current liberal faculty members retires or dies, so they can keep the same "balance" on the faculty? If so, then I'll grant that when such things happen to people on the "right", they aren't facing institutionalized discrimination.
But then there is George Mason, which in Leiter's mind apparently makes up for the other 190 ABA-approved law schools because we hire great candidates who are undervalued on the market on ideological grounds. If there were 50, or even 25, George Masons I'd acknowledge that Leiter has a point, but Mason can only absorb 35 or so of the 8,000 faculty slots available at American law schools.
I focus on law schools because that's familiar turf, but all indications are that law schools are actually much more open-minded, and much more tolerant of right-of-center views, than are other university departments, including many economics departments, Leiter's embodiment of the "right-wing". (Do we have any libertarian economics professors in the audience who want to comment on Leiter's ridiculous claim that "free market utopianism" "dominates economics?")
Leiter bemoans the controversy over poor Joseph Massad at Columbia, without noting the unlikelihood that someone like him would ever get hired by an institution like Columbia to begin with but for his ideology, and the related impossibility that even a top-notch scholar sympathetic to Israel would get hired in Massad's Edward-Said-influenced department. Top universities have found it necessary to create special "Israel Studies" programs and chairs because Departments of Middle Eastern Studies are so closed to anyone who wants to do objective, much less sympathetic, scholarship on Israel.
In fairness to Leiter, if one's worldview is to the left of Noam Chomsky's, the whole world, even academia, is going to look very "conservative". Even then, it would be hard to believe without willful blindness that economics is a more "ideological" subject than is "Women's Studies," even though economics professors range all over the ideological map, and Women's Studies professors, well, don't, and even though economics departments don't declare themselves to have an ideological mission, while Women's Studies departments often do (e.g.).
So even if I did share Leiter's worldview, I might be embarrassed to advertise my tunnel vision.
UPDATE: Ask and ye shall receive. A study of the views of 264 academic members of the American Economics Association concludes that "[o]nly a small percentage of AEA members ought to be called supporters of free-market principles. Whether the AEA is, in this respect, representative of the economics profession is an interesting matter, but we doubt that the AEA is skewed to any great extent." Thanks to reader "Lowell" for the pointer.
Do you have any evidence at all that his views on Israel had anything -- anything -- to do with Summers' firing?
Edward Sykes, you realize that it was Leiter, not me, who raised the issue of Israel, right?
See here
CrazyTrain -- from what I heard from people at Harvard at the time, it was one of the "earlier strikes" that made his innocuous and misinterpreted comments about women and science so much more egregious to academics prone to getting the vapors.
So have tons of other academics -- you will have noticed that these divestment campaigns have not been very successful.
DB -- give it up. You have nothing. There are plenty of people in the academy who are pro-Israel. Whatever Summers' views on Israel were, they had nothing to do with his leaving Harvard. You make a fool of yourself by asserting otherwise -- and frankly, the assertion proves a caricature of yourself, i.e. that everything in your mind in some way or another has to do with Israel.
STOP IT. STOP IT. CEASE AND DESIST. We get it. Every post either of you write focuses on Bernstein and Israel. Sykes regularly accuses Bernstein of being more loyal to Israel than the U.S. I don't care.
It is irrelevant to this thread. Take it outside, stop trying to change the subject, and simply refrain from posting if you cannot address the topic at hand. Leiter brought up the Summers/Israel point (which, if you were paying attention back at the time, WAS one of the "big strikes" against Summers in the eyes of the Harvard faculty that ran him out), not Bernstein. I wish he hadn't, though, because now you two are going to try and run this thread off in the wrong direction.
But no conservative seeking tenure in the past 50 years was ever denied tenure because of liberal politicians or outside interest groups lobbying, right?
I'm sure you know a lot about law schools, but your discussion of "other departments" is way off the mark. In fact, one might conclude you've got "tunnel vision".
You're making me go all McEnroe "you CANNOT be SERIOUS" here...
How about some other departments? Okay - History; Politics; Public Policy; Sociology; Anthropology; English...
When I was an undergrad (Princeton), there was some analysis of the party registrations in each of these departments. I believe that none of them had more than one Republican at the time. I don't recall the exact numbers, but I believe that Greens outnumbered Republicans.
Keep in mind that when people talk about the Ivy League, Princeton is often considered one of the "conservative" ones.
Let me guess - Princeton has no conservative English professors because George Bush has poor command of the language when speaking publicly, right? I think this is why the department was heavily Republican in the Reagan years. Oh. Nevermind.
In several posts in this blog, you have made it perfectly clear that your take on Daubert is no different than any run of the mill tort-reform pro-business "conservative."
I guess on the day of that interview you were on you very best behavior not to allow your personal view to influence your "empirical" piece, eh?
Of course, there's a pretty elementary logical fallacy in your argument (such as it is). The fact that, e.g., people who don't believe in evolution are likely to be conservative does not mean that conservatives are necessarily unlikely to believe in evolution (you can google Venn Diagrams for an illustration). This is especially true when we start looking at the academically inclined right-leaning population.
I suggest you look at this study before citing it. Among the questions it asks do determine whether someone is a supporter of "free-market" principles" is whether they oppose using monetary policy to fine-tune the economy, public schools, occupational health and safety rules, and air and water regulations, among others.
Are you really willing to call people who favor these things wild leftists? The paper is simply looney libertarianism.
As for the Summers/feminism issue, people ought to read the discussion of the issue by Carol Tavris that Skeptical Inquirer published a while back (sometime in 2005, I think).
It greatly saddens me that the Gramscians are winning everywhere. As Rand said, ideas win in the long run. Most of our kids are growing up to despise property rights and love government, among other things. The left will not give up this position of power because it ensures they will win in the long run. And when the left wins, humanity loses. Always and everywhere, without exception.
But Brian is wrong about economics. Several Nobel laureates have made their names arguing against strict laissez faire principles. While free trade is very fundamental to the conservative economic principle he is talking about, there is a current substantial dissenting position (Stiglitz, Rodrik, etc.) Economics is judged by the math and the numbers. If they can support a contrary position, they are taken seriously. Other areas, which lack the discipline of math and numbers, can more easily lapse into ideology
Richard Bradley, "The Crimson Coup," Boston Mag., June 2006.
Nut grafs:
I'm sorry, but I am calling BS on this story. I would love to see the actual text of the question. This is the type of claim that makes conservatives seem utterly unhinged when it comes playing the victim in the marketplace of campus ideology.
Within academia, there are. Physics profs vote in faculty senates in addition to English profs, so many of the intra-university issues that attract outside attention are political issues, and therefore the political affiliation of hard science faculty is relevant. That matters to questions over whether there is discrimination against conservatives in academia. (Keep in mind that what one means by conservative is not always clear; it is often equated with Republicans, which is not the case).
----
Sorry, but I saw a question like this on my wife's application for an MS in Social Work program. It was pretty specific and talked about your personal commitment to "Social Justice". It was pretty clear what the right answers were, too.
"But how many times in the last 50 years have 'liberal' politicians and interest groups outside universities successfully mobilized to get someone fired or even threatened that person's tenure because of 'conservative' views?"
This is very careful and rather disingenious language by Prof Leiter. Yes, it is unusual for liberal groups "outside" the university to exert pressure. This is because the pressure comes from the liberal orthodoxy *inside* the university.
I would assume Prof Leiter is aware of the Foundation For Individual Rights in Education (FIRE) and their invaluable website at www.thefire.org. FIRE's mission is to defend and sustain individual rights at America's colleges and universities and they attack both liberal and conservative restrictions on freedoms at universities. However, a trawl through their case history shows far more restrictions imposed by a liberal viewpoint than vice versa (though Prof Bernstein's George Mason is interestingly cited as one of the examples of the latter).
There are a number of cases cited showing internal liberal "groups" mobilizing to get people fired or denied tenure. Two examples of many:
http://www.thefire.org/index.php/article/8164.html
http://www.thefire.org/index.php/article/7167.html
Of course, there is also the well documented tenure issues of recent guest blogger KC Johnson at Brooklyn College.
Is there no way to answer that by discussing conservative principles? Is Social Justice an inherently liberal idea?
That you thought there was a "right answer" is only relevant to your state of mind, not the school's. If you go into the process assuming a liberal bias, then any question would have a "right answer." It's actually a very efficient self-fulfilling prophecy -- they don't want me, which is evidenced by their questions, so I won't apply, which means there won't be anyone like me, which is evidence they don't want me.
Obviously, they disbelieve their own theory in their own cases?
I worked for a time at a distinctly non-ivy state school in a distinctly non-eastern state. There was no doubt about the relative political positions among the social science professors; there was one conservative, who stood out like a sore right thumb. The rest ran the political gamut from hard leftism to mild leftism.
I don't understand why people have such a hard time grappling with the fact of a liberal bias in academia. One can say that the U.S. military, for example, is a fairly conservative institution, and people don't get all defensive about it.
(As for Leiter, the Emperor's comment seems most trenchant to me. If you're a Brian Leiter, or an Eric Alterman, EVERYTHING seems conservative; and per Marx, moderate liberals are the worst of all.)
It's also kind of jarring to see the posts above admit that, well, yes, social science faculties at "elite eastern universities" are liberal, but others aren't. This would seem to raise a host of questions. Like, what about Berkeley? OK, Stanford? Michigan? What is it about the elite eastern universities that magically transforms their social science faculty members into liberals, and yet does not effect wanna-be-elite universities at, well, everywhere else? Etc.
Sorry, but it strikes me that those acknowledging the liberal bent of "elite eastern universities" only do so in the wake of studies presenting near-ironclad proof of the obvious; my sense is that, in the absence of such studies, they would be disputing the notion tooth and nail.
- Alaska Jack
It was nearly eight years ago, and I didn't save the questions. But I remember the incident, and I also remember my son's deciding not to apply to that school. So you can call me a liar--a standard leftist claim, these days. But it happened.
Indeed. I'm glad he didn't suggest a special website for all the hyper-Israel Jewish bloggers ... what would one call it, I wonder?
I don't think anyone is being *forced* to click &read DB's threads. I find DB frequently annoying (&the feeling is mutual, I'm sure), but I don't quite see how that translates into "go blog elsewhere."
(There's the Elimin-a-Blogger feature on the VC site, but I've never been able to make it work.)
I'm not saying you made the story up. I'm saying I doubt the question actually asked what you perceived it to be asking. Rather than repeating myself, I refer you to my previous post.
Even though the reason that Chemerinsky's reason for initially having his offer revoked was because he was too vocal about his opinions in a job that had been agreed to requiring public detachment from controversy, many otherwise responsible people keep claiming it was because his opinions were leftist.
Of course this is ignoring the fact that the man doing the hiring says he agrees with Chemerinsky politically.
But, go ahead, keep repeating a false story because that generates more discussion.
(my favorite anecdote on this one: i was sitting in a crowded school cafe at a table where a preppy white kid was meeting with a hipster graduate assistant (with "impeach bush" button) to find out why the student's paper had been graded poorly. the GA explained that the prof wanted to read a discussion about the text's treatment of women and people of color, which was difficult, said the GA, because that's not what the author thought he was writing about and becuause there were almost no passages in the text that dealt with the issue. at that point, the student's face was contorted in confusion. the GA went on to explain that later in the semester, when the class turned to the novels that the prof had selected (which wasn't the case with the novel the student had written about), it would be much easier to write about social exclusion and domination. the GA walked away and i spent about five minutes schooling the poor kid on how a humanities education actually works. i am certain that his next paper "interrogated the unspoken privileges of the white man.")
Are you really willing to call people who favor these things wild leftists?
Yes.
[ed: complaint about editor follows. Anyone who doesn't like the topics, or tone, or whatever, of my posts in general, is free to use the "select a blogger" feature, just pass over them, blog about them elsewhere or even complain to blogmaster Eugene. Don't waste bandwith and distract the conversation in the comments about a specific post. For select a blogger, see http://volokh.com/archives/archive_2004_11_00.shtml#1099419750]
However, I have to bristle at the idea that economics is ideologically conservative because most economists are very supportive of free trade and markets (look at the SAEE study as reviewed in "The Myth of the Rational Voter"...the fact that they are not as supportive as the caricature of them hardly shows much). For starters economists also have very many traditionally liberal views (welfare and foreign aid are not serious economic concerns). However, all of this misses the point.
Economists are experts in and study economics and the effects of free trade are an economic question and economics is a genuine empirical science (though it should be more empirical). So while it's possible that economists views on free trade and markets are the result of ideology our default assumption should be that economists views on markets and free trade simply reflect greater knowledge of the facts. Once again I refer the reader to The Myth of the Rational Voter (chapter 3) where the author makes a very good data driven case that it is actual knowledge of economics not political affiliation that explains economists views on these subjects.
Ultimately most people agree on the desired outcomes for an economy (wealth, equality, alleviating suffering) and the question is merely whether free markets are a good way to achieve it. If this turns out to be a simple fact it is no more evidence of conservative ideology that people believe it than it is evidence of liberal ideology that people accept evolution.
Also remember that one can support free trade and markets and believe that the government should step in to soften the blows of these forces on societies least well off. I think it is the result of ideological blinders to assume that just because many republicans use the language of markets and trade to justify denying these services everyone who advocates for markets and trade must as well.
"In the end, I think any candidate with political views in the minority (in which category I include radical left, as well as conservative or libertarian) must be significantly better than the normal appointment at a particular school to have a chance of getting a job offer from that school."
This is the source you cited to support your position. Do you agree with it?
Take the paper grading story above. could the bad grade have anything to do with the fact that the paper was likely poorly written? Or that he was writing on something other than the prompt? I've met very few undergrads who will own up to their own mistakes. did they fail the test because they didn't study enough? did they fail the essay because they read the book at the last minute and cranked out 5 pages of BS? nope. nope. its the "evil" teacher who wrote bad test questions or its the "evil" TA who just doesn't like me.
Tony, as I understand it, there were two concerns:
1) The responsibility Summers bore for Harvard's years-long defense of Shleifer, on legal grounds that were apparently very shaky, which was both financially expensive and costly to their reputation, instead of settling the case back in 2001.
2) The fact that Summers flat-out lied to the faculty about the case: "he president responded in a manifestly untruthful way to questions that were asked about the Shleifer case," in the words of political science prof Robert Putnam, a supporter of Summers until that point.
Sadly, this features does not work with your posts. The url to exclude your posts should be: http://volokh.com/?exclude=DavidB. But your (*deleted for civility*) posts continue to appear.
Another change is that few fields like corporate law have become so dominated by law and economics that it would be difficult for a leftist who is hostile to the premises of l &e to break in. You can be very liberal and do l &e, but I don't know if you can easily be a "leftist."
But note that I mentioned that law is actually much more diverse ideologically than many other fields; I don't think leftist historians have any trouble at all getting hired.
Are you really willing to call people who favor these things wild leftists?
Yes.
OK. You're entitled. But don't expect to be taken seriously when you complain about how the universities are dominated by "wild leftists" who think the Federal Reserve, for example, is a good idea.
I just read the McClintick article, which contrives to give the impression that while serving as Treasury Secretary, Summers was somehow supervising Shleifer in Russia. This might be tolerable had McClintick not excused two years of inattention on the part of Shleifer's supervisor, Sachs. Considering that in 2000, the year before Summers became President, the U.S. wanted $120 million from Harvard, an actual payout of $26.5 million sounds like a good deal.
Frankly it sounds like a hatchet job. Also, I would expect the faculty to be disgruntled because they were not clued in. But spending $26 million is really none of their business -- that's the responsibility of the President and Fellows.
Strength of this median: exposure to new data, links, views
Weakness: encourages repetition of argument, too many points simultaneously for effective refutation and resolution, leads to a sullen belief in the intransigence of others.
In some cases, discerning the bias--and the political content of the term--may not require a leap of faith. For example, see FIRE's description of a standard school of education requirement that students demonstrate a commitment to social justice and diversity.
When the Columbia University Teachers College offical Conceptual Framework states that
and that
and elsewhere the same school notes that these
it's not a great leap of faith.
Short answer: yes.
In math: PDE methods in geometry vs algebraic ones. Computer-generated proofs.
In computer science: Static typing vs dynamic typing.
In physics: copenhagen quantum mechanics vs others (GRW, Bohmian). String theory vs the rest.
Personal anecdote: I'm aware of only 1 department in the US that will hire a unification person who doesn't do strings. Bohmian mechanics people have serious difficulties getting hired, in ways very similar to what you described happening to conservatives (GRW people fare slightly better).
Would that possibly be because in physics, you can tell if someone is right or not?
I'm not sure what Leiter means by "free-market utopianism" so it's difficult for me to answer that. I'm not an academic economist (or any other kind) either, so my knowledge of the ideological positions academic economists hold is limited, but not non-existent.
My impression is that there is, on the whole, a strong belief that markets are generally excellent institutions, but that there are clearly situations where regulation is useful, or alternatives are better, either for reasons of equity or because the conditions for the market to produce its wondrous results are absent.
In general I think economists are much more "pro-market" than the public at large (or the public in jail). Look at the two ideas that were extremely strongly opposed - tariffs and govt ownership of enterprise. I think these are examples of what I am talking about, and that you would get less opposition from the public. On the other hand, I would be extremely surprised if there were many who favored abolishing the Fed, or doing away with environmental regulation.
My point is that the survey in question does not justify the conclusion. It is perfectly possible to support market principles and at the same time favor laws restricting air pollution. Indeed, many would argue that absent such laws the market does not do a big part of what it is supposed to do - allocate costs to those who use resources.
Somehow, I have a hard time imagining that Socrates would disagree with that.
The seemingly pro-market bent of economists likely comes from their greater knowledge and study of the subject.
First, markets are closely linked to the development of homo sapiens. People have trading for tens (if not hundreds) of thousands of years. In many cultures, trade independently developed into markets (e.g., open air markets).
Second, trade and markets solve a fundamental problems with resource allocation. One party gives up X to get Y while the other party gives up Y to get X. Both party must think that they are made better off otherwise they would not agree to the deal. This is known as "the gains to trade."
Trade allows resources can be reallocated while making both parties better off. In contrast, a third party (e.g., a government bureaucrat) cannot readily determine whether given reallocation of resources will make both parties better off.
Even many socialistic economists tend to be supportive of markets for certain purposes. For example, the social democracts of western europe intentionally allowed markets to continue operating in many spheres, largely for the reasons listed above.
As far as the distinction between "looney libertarians" and "free market utopians," I can assure you that most mainstream economists do not fall into either category. For example, the concept of market externalities is accepted by virtually all mainstream economists. That disqualifies them from being "free market utopians." Moreover, since most mainstream economists believe that the government should address these externalities, they can't be considered "looney libertarians," either.
This is, at the least, misleading if not a complete misunderstanding of the existence of groups such as the Association of Israel Studies, which, as stated on its website, is, along with many other specialist groups, a part of the much maligned MESA. Named chairs, such as chairs in Jewish Studies are most often endowed by those with interests in the areas. I know of no "top universities" that have found it necessary to create Israeli Studies programs outside of their existing Middle Eastern or Area studies programs, in particular because of bias within their own institutions. There may be some but I am sceptical without any empirical evidence.
Socrates wasn't big on taking things for granted. But how do you know that he would agree with Teachers College that a particular set of notions, regarding the legitimacy of a particular social order, is taken for granted?
And how do you know that Socrates would agree with Teachers College that those particular notions, about a particular social order, are flawed?
And why are you confident that he would see change agency--independent of any particular kind of change--as a moral imperative?
On this point about physicists, can someone back that up with links to good stats? IIRC, the humanities were by far the most left, which means if we take physics to be the yardstick, we'd have to attribute any further-left-than-physics in the humanities to mere intellectual and political fashion.
This falls into the "news I can use" category.
www.law.com/jsp/LawArticlePC.jsp?id=1056139960618
So who cares what law school professors and deans think? They are usually not out here in the trenches slugging it out on a day to day basis. I did my three years, and neither me nor my money have been back since.
No one sensible is claiming bias in physics,
Post modernism is affecting them too.
Engineering is where conservatives hang out, in part because engineers know Murphy.
No Charley it is because physics is about theory. And in theory Communism is best. In practice (engineering) it not only doesn't work. It may in fact cause devolution.
Has anyone noticed the Left has nothing to redistribute until the Right makes it?
9.25.2007 6:00pm
Joe Lieberman - the former next Vice President of the USA.
He says that because there is no such thing as a perfectly informed market, government can help.
My question: if information is not perfect how will government know what to do? What is to prevent a government agent from helping his brother in law?
Perhaps the 1990 Internet was badly skewed towards computer science, engineering, math and science? Anyway, what I most remember about 1990 is that no one would have lumped libertarians and conservatives into a single group. The libertarians who had signed on with Reagan were still considered people who had changed political philosophies.
That includes people from the world around, and it means that the part of the right wing credo having to do with demonizing people from other nations (we have been at war with East Asia since 40 years), beating on the nativist drums (build a wall around Amurica) and more does not play very well.
There are obviously also science issues where the likes of Inhofe get short shrift, but that is professional.
The point about physics being theory driven is right, but so, even more so is economics. Chemistry, otoh, is still primarily synthesis driven and departments are about the same politically.
I’m a lawyer in private practice. For pedigree purposes, I went to the U of Tennessee for undergrad due to money issues (accepted to Yale). I went to Virginia Law due to money issues (accepted to Harvard, Chicago, NYU, Columbia; dinged by Yale). I’m happy as a clam with my choices and point acceptances out only because, after reading through the prior posts, mainly academics weigh-in here. And pedigree matters more in your world than mine. So, just clearing the air.
Bernstein’s first para said: “So let's just focus on one statement: ‘But how many times in the last 50 years have 'liberal' politicians and interest groups outside universities successfully mobilized to get someone fired or even threatened that person's tenure because of 'conservative' views?’”
All of the discussion in the thread (that I have read, anyway) focuses on academics. Which makes sense given the tenure reference in the quote above and the nature of this blog.
To throw some non-academic seasoning into the mix, however, I can tell you that I have seen people get fired for “conservative views” in a private setting. I can tell you that I consider it a liability within my firm that I continue to list my membership in The Federalist Society on my bio. I have seen people fired for stating a “truth that dare not speak its name.” I can tell you that I’ve been told, explicitly, because I’m a white male, that “no one cares because we have enough of you.”
I can also tell you that I would have preferred to be an English professor than a lawyer, but that I had (liberal) professors (who thought very highly of me) tell me candidly that I was of the wrong race, gender and political predisposition to have a snowball’s chance. I’m glad for their advice, but sad, and more importantly, scared, for its necessity. Our universities should be better than to call for such advice.
Letalius’ post at 9.25.2007 10:41pm denigrates academics’ relevance. I disagree. Academics are highly relevant. Which is why I’m posting here. Academics are intellectual leaders. Unfortunately, I think most academics are quick-stepping in the wrong direction either due to mistaken premises or, more shamefully, peer pressure.
Sorry to nitpick at length (but I can't resist) - the main point about libertarians seems pretty much true from my memory, although it might have just been the libertarian-types were just the loudest back then. The rest, less true. The “internet” and “usenet” are different things (if mostly overlapping today). In 1990, I am pretty sure almost all usenet traffic was still being transferred over UUCP, or Unix to Unix CoPy, a cooperative network of machines storing and forwarding traffic in batches that was eventually superceded by the current internet. Because usenet could have commercial messages, it was banned from Fed-funded ARPAnet and NFSnet, two of the biggest early internet backbones. Usenet even still has its UUCP legacy showing the network path taken (machine1!machine2!machine3); most who sent usenet e-mail coast-to-coast back then probably remembers “decvax!decwrl” or the reverse; a lot of the late 80s/early 90s usenet traffic transferred overnight between these two machines through Digital Equipment Corp.’s internal network. When I was an undergraduate in the mid-1980s, my university and schools many of my friends attended gave easy access to the usenet; bigger public colleges and non-technical schools were just slow in allowing access. Direct internet access was much harder to get. Even in the mid-80s, I don’t remember usenet “overwhelmingly populated by academics who were at least graduate students”; I remember plenty of undergraduates there, and UUCP/Usenet even started getting significant numbers of users from nonacademic commercial networks well before 1990 (Fidonet connected in 1986, and I seem to remember plenty of Bitnet traffic on the Usenet by 1990). Again, the internet was different, but most parts of the internet were still only available for academic research unrelated to usenet back then.
HBD, for the last 30 years, where has opposition to evolutionary theory come from?
If you think the most numerous and staunchly anti-evolution constituency in the U.S. is conservative white Republicans, you are wrong. American blacks, who are overwhelmingly liberal Democrats, are also overwhelmingly adherents of Christian sects that reject evolution.
And opposition to things like the big bang theory...
The Big Bang Theory dates from the work of Lemaitre and Hubble in the 1920's. Much of the initial opposition to the idea came from atheist and socialist Brits and Europeans who were simply aghast at the idea that there could posibly have been a "creation," however defined. The competing Steady State Theory of the universe was still considered at least somewhat intellectually respectable until the early 60's when Penzias and Wilson stumbled upon the cosmic background microwave noise now regarded as the "echo" of the Big Bang.
The idea that "progressive" and "pro-science" are synonyms is easily shown to be frequently at serious variance with the facts.
Read the whole thing, but alas you much read the cached verision, because Leiter has tucked it away so it is no longer available at his blog.
Now I'm not critisizing the message, after all it is a one of the premium features of the internet to rip some dense idiot a new one. But it does bespeak someone that wants to debate credentials rather than ideas. One who hides behind their academic credentials to shield them from arguments where their ideas can't carry the day, of course while living on the public teat.
Your point makes no sense in the big picture, either. Your argument is "These are good things, so therefore people should support them." But that has nothing to do with the issue of whether someone is a supporter of free market principles; all you're saying is that supporting free-market principles isn't always good. But that's just your bias.
Academics are leaders only so long as they lead. Once they stop being leaders, people stop listening and they become just another dusty old museum exhibit. Noisy ones that must be endured in this case, but just as irrelevant.
Peace.
Third, it is very important to recognize that the really lively fault lines in the profession do not have to do with politics but with methods. This is where the Nation piece on heterodox economics a few months ago goes off the rails, because the Nation (as is its habit) wants to shoehorn everything into a left/right divide. Debates about, for example, about the extent to which empirical work in economics should directly embody theory (i.e. between "structural" and "reduced form") work, does not fall into any neat left/right divide. Neither do debates about the value of behavioral economics. Economics is not free of politics in the sense of this thread, but there are a lot of other things going on as well that explain a much larger fraction of the variance in things like hiring, publiciation and so on.
Exactly right; the Vatican expressed guarded acceptance for much the same reason, in reverse.
Leftists can come up w/ plenty of anecdotes about professors who dismiss their views -- say downgrading an essay in an international politics course because it mentions Chomsky, not because what Chomsky says about that topic is wrong. That doesn't mean that most political scientists are conservative.
Years ago I considered the possibility of going into speech therapy and audiology as a profession. I received an admissions packet to the graduate department from a top-notch university.
They gave a bullet point description of the candidates they were looking for. The last item: "A commitment to affirmative action."
What the hell does a commitment to affirmative action have to do with helping people with speech impediments learn how to speak properly?
I didn't bother applying.
And this notion that conservatism=anti-science is absurd. It is precisely because the physical sciences are built around the idea that there are universal and absolute truths (F=GM1M2/r2, for example) that are not culturally determined that conservatives have considerable respect and support for the physical sciences.
It is interesting that when there are well qualified—indeed, astonishingly over-qualified physical scientists—who don't buy the current agenda, they get passed over for tenure. For example, Guillermo Gonzalez is an astronomy professor at Iowa State. To have authored 68 peer-reviewed papers before tenure is stunning.
Gonzalez leads his department in citation analyses, even though his more senior colleagues have been working for decades longer. But Gonzalez has expressed doubt about an article of the True Faith, and there has been a concerted effort by leftist faculty to have him drummed out for thinking wrong:
There's really no question that the left is grossly disproportionate among faculty, and that they frequently use their position to punish those that think conservative thoughts.
On the other hand, there were classes that were nothing but political tirade. My wife took a Critical Thinking class in the philosophy department that had an excellent textbook—with a leftist bias, but it wasn't too bad. Unfortunately, the professor made almost no use of it—every day (when he didn't cancel class completely, which was frequent) was a political tirade about George Bush Sr. It wasn't even about using current events as a springboard for a discussion of critical thinking—there wasn't even a pretense.
There was an ethnic studies class that I took that was a complete and utter joke—to the point that we used a textbook that claimed that the binary logic of computers was a Western cultural construct, and there was serious question about whether computers would work in non-Western societies.
My wife took a Musics of the World class in which the professor was going on about Native American music and how, "They respected the environment, unlike the white Christian Europeans who came in to destroy everything." This isn't just polemical; it is historically inaccurate.
My daughter and son-in-law are working on MSWs right now—and they have professors who have abandoned all pretense that they are teaching social work. A class on family structure and social work? The semester was devoted to the problems of global warming—and the instructions for the term paper indicated that no paper expressing doubt about the anthropogenic origins of global warming would be accepted.
This semester, they have another class that is supposedly about social work—but the reading list is about war, including embarrassing polemical, reductionistic trash like the comic book Addicted to War.
One student was kicked out of the social work program (and yes, they can do that) because the question came up about reparative therapy. One student was quite supportive of that for homosexuals that weren't comfortable with their sexual orientation—and boom, out she went.
Some ideas scare the left so much that they don't allow any serious discussion of alternatives.
When I took chemistry and physics, we were able to test at least some of the basic equations. In physics class, we use an air cushion table to measure velocities resulting from impacts, and calculate the amount of energy imparted. From this, we were able to determine that less than 1% of the energy was lost to friction and heating. In a high school physics class, we went out and measured how rapidly a black object heated up in sunlight. From this, we were able to calculate the total number of watts per square meter arriving at the ground. My recollection was that it was about 30% less than the supposed value at the top of the atmosphere.
Of course, we did experiments with falling objects of different masses.
In chemistry class, we did experiments involving pH and the effects of various buffers.
All of these involve experimental verification, and can be properly called provable fact.
Some of the claims made in biology classes, while I am prepared to believe them, aren't really experimentally verifiable. Ditto for some cosmological claims in physics and astronomy classes. I'm prepared to work with these claims, but to become insistent like a fundamentalist that we know WITHOUT DOUBT that all of these claims are true (as many biology teachers teach this subject) is bad science.
When I was taking chemistry at USC, one of my professors, part way through the lecture on electron clouds and probability distributions, suddenly turned around and told us, "These are all just models. There could be angels dancing on the heads of pins for all we know. But these models let us predict what will happen, and that's what science is all about." The wisdom of a practicing scientist.
A bit less arrogance in how the experimentally unverifiable claims are presented—especially since those claims have changed substantially in a century, and some have changed in major details since I was in high school—would go a long ways to defuse much of the upset.
Your point makes no sense in the big picture, either. Your argument is "These are good things, so therefore people should support them." But that has nothing to do with the issue of whether someone is a supporter of free market principles; all you're saying is that supporting free-market principles isn't always good. But that's just your bias.
David,
I did read it. Note that they threw out the monetary policy question (and the one about military action abroad) after they got the results. That suggests they didn't put a lot of thought into the survey beforehand. Their explanation as to why they threw it out is revealing. It was that they feared respondents saw the question as a choice between fiscal and monetary policy rather than as purely about the desirability of monetary policy. That implies that Klein and Stern, at least, think the Fed violates "free-market principles."
Yes, they averaged responses across many questions, but they were mostly of the same nature - how do you feel about some type of policy that we dislike? Most of the policies discussed were not, strictly speaking, economic policies at all. They were, rather, things like environmental regulation and occupational health and safety rules that Klein and Stern presumably disapprove of.
As to "supporting free-market principles," I'm not even sure that's a well-defined term. If it means, as you and the authors seem to think, that one believes the market will solve all these problems if simply left alone then it's true that I, and most economists, and most people, are not supporters of free-market principles.
If it means understanding the power of markets, but with due regard for their limitations, then I think it is perfectly possible to be a "supporter of free-market principles" without opposing the policies addressed in the paper. The fact is that Klein and Stern use a radical definition, and then complain that economists do not, in general, fit the definition.
Take the minimum wage question. That's straight economics, and free market doctrine clearly would rule out any minimum wage. Yet study made clear that a large number of economists are not strongly opposed to a minimum wage. That pretty much defeats any claim that economists are single minded or free market utopians.
It's nice to have friends, although I usually prefer to drink alone, hence the nickname. But here was the original URL for the post I linked:
"//webapp.utexas.edu/blogs/archives/bleiter 00359.html#000359"
It appears Leiter moved his blog, evidently at least his blog is no longer on the public teat.