The Volokh Conspiracy

N.Y. Times Quotes Volokh Conspiracy:

"I think it is fair to say that the D.C. Circuit has repudiated the vast bulk of the Bush administration's clean-air regulatory reforms, which were the administration's most notable and significant (if not always wise) environmental policy initiatives," Jonathan Adler, a law professor at Case Western Reserve University, commented on the case on a legal affairs blog, The Volokh Conspiracy.

Not the first such quote (I think there have been four other New York Times quotes of our posts before this one), but always nice to see.

UPDATE: Whoops, forgot to include the link to Jonathan's original post.

David Warner:
Somewhat impish question:

Had you it all to do over again, knowing then what you know now, would you have named the blog differently?
8.20.2008 2:08pm
Eugene Volokh (www):
No -- why would I? The name is unusual and memorable. It's kind of odd to have a legit operation named the "Conspiracy," but that just makes it stand out more (and makes it a bit amusing, I like to think, since what "conspiracy" would publicly label itself a conspiracy?).
8.20.2008 2:17pm
josh:
Well ... the New York Times ... Liberal Media ... Not To Be Trusted ...
8.20.2008 2:17pm
A.W. (mail):
Seriously, who cares about the NYT. i mean feel good if you want, but you are better than them. and more reliable, too.
8.20.2008 2:20pm
David M. Nieporent (www):
(I think there have been four other New York Times quotes of our posts before this one)
But who's counting?
8.20.2008 2:21pm
Just Dropping By (mail):
A Lexis search returns 10 unique hits in the NYT for "Volokh Conspiracy".

These ones contain quotes from the blog:
Aug. 20, 2008; Mar. 18, 2008; Aug. 19, 2006; June 20, 2005

These ones mention the blog, but don't quote it:
Mar. 19, 2007; Dec. 24, 2006; Aug. 30, 2006; Dec. 18, 2005; Oct. 7, 2005; Dec. 2, 2004

(There's also a duplicate of the March 18, 2008 story.)
8.20.2008 2:36pm
Cornellian (mail):
I like the name Volokh Conspiracy. The names works in a literal sense, since there's more than one blogger named Volokh and you do have an agreement (to blog). You don't have the other half of a criminal conspiracy, namely that the agreement is to commit some crime, but maybe it's a tortious (not criminal) conspiracy. Some of the posts here are sufficiently far afield from the legal status quo that "conspiracy" in a tortous sense works in a nice, edgy sort of way. We have an agreement to "harm" the legal status quo.
8.20.2008 2:57pm
zippypinhead:
"You don't have the other half of a criminal conspiracy, namely that the agreement is to commit some crime..."
Have you asked the Thought Police for their opinion on this issue?

But seriously, it's interesting that the NYT is apparently monitoring VC blog posts (not to mention quoting them authoritatively).
8.20.2008 3:26pm
Helene Edwards (mail):
I'd be more interested in a bio from JustDroppingBy, who hasn't yet mastered use of the word "these." Affirmative action admit?
8.20.2008 3:42pm
Bored Lawyer:

You don't have the other half of a criminal conspiracy, namely that the agreement is to commit some crime


This is off-topic, but this point always bothered me when Hillary Clinton referenced a "Vast Right Wing Conspiracy."

A conspiracy is more than agreement -- it is an agreement to commit a crime. If three people agree to meet at a local restaurant at noon, that is not a "Conspiracy to Do Lunch" because lunch is not a crime.

There is no question that there was a large, organized political opposition to then-President Clinton. But that Hillary viewed it as a "conspiracy" speaks volumes about her view of legitimate democratic opposition.
8.20.2008 3:43pm
John Burgess (mail) (www):
As I no longer work there, I can't say whether it's still the case, but I had serious trouble with State Dept. Net Nannies in getting them to unblock the VC. 'Conspiracy' did cause heartburn among the technoid paranoids, or at least in whatever net monitoring software they were implementing.

After a couple of months' of back-and-forth, I was able to convince them that US Constitutional Law issues were indeed something I needed to follow for professional reasons.
8.20.2008 4:10pm
David Warner:
"No -- why would I? The name is unusual and memorable. It's kind of odd to have a legit operation named the "Conspiracy," but that just makes it stand out more"

Your trust in your fellow man is touching, and I daresay a bit inspiring.

Conspire on.
8.20.2008 4:15pm
Eugene Volokh (www):
Helene Edwards: Unless I'm missing something, your comment would be needlessly rude even if Just Dropping By had made an error.

But on top of that, I don't see the error. I assume you're suggesting "these ones" is wrong, and a quick Google search did reveal to me that some people say it's "incorrect" (see, for instance, here and here). Saying that something is incorrect, though, isn't the same as demonstrating it, even under some prescriptivist theory.

Nor is the argument that "these ones" can be shortened to "these" persuasive. Lots of usages that can be shortened are quite normal, and aren't evidence of lack of "mastery" of the words involved. So if you have some authorities or arguments that support your position, please let us know.
8.20.2008 4:41pm
Eugene Volokh (www):
David Warner: I'm not sure exactly what reaction you're contemplating on the part of some observers. If you think that some people will think us unserious because of our name, I suppose that's possible; but I think the risk is outweighed by the probability that some people will find the name amusing (and therefore appealing) or at least memorable.
8.20.2008 4:47pm
Just Dropping By (mail):
Dear Helene,

Why don't you educate all of us on the proper usage of "these"?
8.20.2008 4:55pm
John M. Perkins (mail):
As to the NYT monitoring VC, I believe it has to do with VC being selected by LEXIS as a news source. NYT probably searches LEXIS, and VC is selected as a quality hit.
8.20.2008 5:00pm
David Warner:
"I'm not sure exactly what reaction you're contemplating on the part of some observers."

Well, you blog. Most readers of the The Grey Lady newspapers don't, and tend to harbor colorful theories regarding those who do. I certainly share your hope that the name of your blog enhances, rather than detracts from, the likelihood that your contributions to the national conversation gain a wider hearing.

I know that sounds stuffy, but I've been reading, and of course enjoying immensely, Johnson and Churchill. Wonder what Churchill would have done with electronic media....
8.20.2008 7:43pm
Eugene Volokh (www):
Hmm -- what "colorful theories"? If they see "The Volokh Conspiracy" cited, will they start thinking that we're some sort of mafia group that happens to blog on the side? I can see their thinking that we're a little frivolous (though I suppose that our being quoted by the Times in a serious article for a serious proposition will ameliorate that in some measure). But that's about as colorful a theory as I can imagine.
8.20.2008 8:19pm
David Warner:
"Hmm -- what "colorful theories"?"

One guess would be the theory that you're the conspiracy theorists, rather than conspiracy theorees. One can find a case or two of the former when surfing inside the intertubes, you know.

Actually beats me - I'm a trusting soul like you appear to be. I'm just often amazed at the conceptions people have of what the internet is all about, especially blogs.

Stuff like This.
8.20.2008 9:22pm
Hoosier:
"N.Y. Times Quotes Volokh Conspiracy"

So now the quote is wrong?
8.21.2008 12:06am
Larry Fafarman (mail) (www):
Arbitrary censorship of blog visitors' comments makes blogs one-sided and factually unreliable and is an especially big problem because blogs are frequently authoritatively cited by scholarly journal articles, the established news media, court opinions, and other authorities. Highly persuasive dissenting comments are the ones most likely to be arbitrarily censored -- unpersuasive dissenting comments are usually allowed to stay as examples of the supposed weakness of the opposition.

I have never seen any Volokh Conspiracy blogger denounce arbitrary censorship of blog visitors' comments and I fully expect that this perfect (or, should I say, imperfect) record will not be broken in this comment thread.

As for the blog's name, it should be called "The Zionist Conspiracy" because David Bernstein frequently hijacks it to spread his extremist Zionist propaganda.
8.21.2008 12:48am
Eugene Volokh (www):
Let me be on the record as opposed to arbitrary censorship of blog visitors' comments. Of course, wise and sensible editing out of comments is a different matter. The beauty of being an editor is that one gets to decide which is which. And if the result is one-sided, well, law review articles, books, and the like have zero comments. Readers use their judgment to decide whether the work is sound or not.

I should mention that I was thinking of removing Larry Fafarman's comment, because it struck me as at most marginally on-topic, and tiresomely repetitive of his past comments. But then I saw the closing paragraph, and recognized that it's obviously worth keeping -- it's good to know the sort of fellow Mr. Fafarman is.
8.21.2008 1:41am
TokyoTom (mail):
Eugene, nice of you to toot the horn for Jon, who's rather modest. You might also consider adding a cross-link to his related post, so those interested could get the context of Jon's remarks: http://volokh.com/posts/1219156411.shtml
8.21.2008 3:44am
TokyoTom (mail):
Helene, I'm trying to figure out how you jump from a disagreement on grammar to a jab on ethnicity, intellectual firepower and unearned advantages.

But I certain can glean from your remarks that tribalism is alive and well in America, at least among the smug upper crust.
8.21.2008 3:54am
Larry Fafarman (mail) (www):
Eugene Volokh said,
And if the result is one-sided, well, law review articles, books, and the like have zero comments.

What is to prevent the authors of these law review articles, books, etc. from reading the blog visitors' comments and even citing them?

I should mention that I was thinking of removing Larry Fafarman's comment, because it struck me as at most marginally on-topic, and tiresomely repetitive of his past comments.

Being "marginally on-topic" should be good enough because comment sections are called "threads" and not "ramrods" because they supposedly can change direction while maintaining continuity. And there is nothing wrong with repeating the same idea in different threads.

And my comment was definitely on-topic because it raised the issue of why this blog should be authoritatively cited by the NY Times when the bloggers here have no policy against arbitrary censorship of comments.

Also, I noticed that you did not complain that all of the comments about the blog's name are off-topic.

But then I saw the closing paragraph, and recognized that it's obviously worth keeping -- it's good to know the sort of fellow Mr. Fafarman is.

And it is good to know that you are a hypocrite who said he is opposed to arbitrary censorship of blog visitors' comments and then said he was thinking of arbitrarily censoring my comment here. And my comment was especially on-topic because it showed that this blog does not deserve to be authoritatively cited anywhere, let alone the NY Times.

"I'm always kicking their butts -- that's why they don't like me."
-- Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger
8.21.2008 8:22am
Cobarde anonimo:
If one guy is 'hijacking' it to spread Zionist propaganda, is it really a 'Zionist Conspiracy'?
8.21.2008 10:23am
Brian G (mail) (www):
I'll bet more people saw the quote on this blog than saw it in the NY Times.
8.21.2008 11:02am
Hoosier:
Brian G: Yeah. I wonder if the Times will do a story about that.
8.21.2008 2:29pm
David Warner:
"Well ... the New York Times ... Liberal Media ... Not To Be Trusted ..."

Would that the media were more liberal. It's the brain dead softleft shibboleths that send me elsewhere for news/commentary/cultural influence. Left = illiberal. Ask them. They'll tell you. That said, my original question contemplated more the man-on-the-street reaction to the blog name than anything regarding the grey-lady-on-her-foundation-board.

I would not be at all displeased to see the Eugene Volokhs of this world inherit some of that cultural influence the Times has forfeited. My question regarded whether the name the new kid has chosen helps or hinders that process.
8.22.2008 12:16pm