Who would have imagined that the October Surprise would come in November? Or that it'd appear as a blog post at the Volokh Conspiracy?

So a mainstream business-oriented firm, which had ties closer than other businesses* to the nonviolent side of Weather Underground 40 years ago, hired a college graduate who shortly thereafter left for other jobs.

This kind of post, coming from the same guy who wrote the cogent and brilliant expose of Obama's national community service requirements plan, is sad.




*The cardinal value of the connection says little about the ordinal value--how close were those connections

Professor Volokh, aren't you ashamed to let these guys post this sort of crap on your site? Maybe you could lock Profs. Lindgren and Zywicki out until after the election. I don't think they can handle it.

Are you trying to suggest that Obama was right about Vietman like he was about Iraq?

About the only counter-argument the 'bots have been able to come up with that list are logical fallacies.

So faulty logic doesn't weaken an argument? That's quite a novel idea there, 24ahead.

In the 1960s, my mother was involved in radical liberal protests of the Vietnam War. In the early 1980s, I was born. Now I'm voting for Obama.

Let's blame Obama for this too, shall we?

Ignoramus -

See the following Wikipedia link for info on the SDS (Students for a Democratic Society):

I hate to have a part in linking to WP, but here it is.

Also see:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Ayers
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weatherman_(organization)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Klonsky

I actually find posts like this to be meaningful and helpful. I see it as an indicator of the level of pessimism inside the McCain campaign. It's a lot like watching Intrade, where McCain has moved from 12 to 17 and back to 12, in the last five days.

It might help if you explain what "SDS" stands for. I wasn't around in the 1960s and have no idea what you're talking about.

Apparently the 'bots have never heard of networking.

"'Bots?" Something tells me you're not talking about automating self-aggrandizing blog comments.

For all the lawyers here, please explain this hypothetical:

Suppose Obama is deliberately hiding his birth certificate because releasing it would lead to proof of foreign birth [calm down, libs, and don't get the vapors. I'm just asking the question because I'm curious].

How would the legal system handle it if, once sworn into office, it was proven that a candidate was not a U.S. citizen?

And in other equally compelling and persuasive news, Joe "The Plumber" Now Questioning Obama's Loyalty To America.

I'm looking forward to the day Joe "The Plumber" is invited to joint The Volokh Conspiracy as a co-conspirator.

How would the legal system handle it if, once sworn into office, it was proven that a candidate was not a U.S. citizen?

(Disclaimer, I have no idea, I'm just guessing)
After having been sworn in, it would seem to require impeachment.

More interesting is, before he's sworn in but after the House of Representatives has certified the electoral count.

Posner - today's blog with Becker:

Anyone in a public position--and this includes business and academic leaders as well as politicians--cannot indulge a taste for candor or altruism and expect to be successful at his job.

.

Ayers was getting an education degree a few blocks from Obama while Obama 'hid out in the Columbia library like a monk.' Probably smart because one of Ayers friends blew up a vehicle associated with transporting the South African rugby team and is still in jail. A commenter on a blogpost months ago re: Dreams of my Father reported working at Business International when Obama did, said Obama didn't socialize with his peers, worked faxing tip sheets and wasn't the investment banker he says he was.

smokey:

Suppose Obama is deliberately hiding his birth certificate

Suppose Smokey went to the trouble of keeping up with the news:

State declares Obama birth certificate genuine

HONOLULU (AP) — State officials say there's no doubt Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.

Health Department Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino said Friday she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama's original birth certificate.

pmorem:

I really hope the 'bots get de-funded after the election.

Speaking of astroturf, what ever happened to McCain's effort to get people to spread his talking points on blogs?

That worked out well.

I am astonished at the level of determined and willful ignorance regarding our probable next President of the United States. First, any critism is regarded as 'racist'. Asking direct questions is off limits. Now any curiousity about Obama's past at all is verboten.

And I would love to see a similar expose on Lindgren's past--I have no doubt an analogous "gotcha" narrative could be constructed for just about anyone, including you and me and every political figure in the world.

I, for instance, read The Communist Manifesto at the age of 8 or 9 and thought it made a lot of sense.

In the 1960s, my mother was involved in radical liberal protests of the Vietnam War. In the early 1980s, I was born. Now I'm voting for Obama.

Let's blame Obama for this too, shall we?

No, but your mother was way outta line.

sun:

I am an Obama supporter who'd be interested in knowing what he did at Business International

This is not a complete answer, but here are a couple of statements about that era. NYT interviewed his supervisor:

Cathy Lazere, his supervisor at Business International, described him as self-assured and bright. “He was very mature and more worldly than other people — on the surface kind of laid back, but kind of in control,” she said. “He had a good sense of himself, which I think a lot of kids at that age don’t.”

NPR found a colleague who said this:

he was very smooth and smart and together, and I was 23 … I felt like a human train wreck next to him

And I would love to see a similar expose on Lindgren's past

What an interesting comment. Does the BHO campaign have secret dossiers on their opponents?

Could Lindgren do a reverse DNS on the comments above and let us know if he finds anything interesting? For instance, lots of people from Chicago or DC?

As for jukeboxgrad's comment, the state only said he cert was on file, it didn't say he was born there. Under HI law, those who are born outside HI but whose parents live there can get certs.

jukebox, I'm pretty sure you're not one of the 'bots. Same goes for Oren. Even without knowing you, I'm pretty sure you're real people doing this on your own time.

There are a number of people, particularly some of the most strident, who are somewhere between sockpuppet and 'bot. My understanding is that the Obama camp maintains a fair number of people on the payroll to monitor blogs and oppose anything that challenges Obama.

Cripes, another post where Sarcasto does all the comments.

24Ahead, my mention of Lindgren's past was meant as a suggestion that he examine the beam in his own eye before condemning the mote in Obama's. Perhaps it was too indirect a suggestion for this audience. I am sorry that you found it threatening. If you would be comforted by learning more about where and who I am, go ahead and email me. (I don't work for Obama's campaign, not even as a volunteer, although I have made donations to his campaign.)

What a weak and pathetic attempt to smear Obama.

The next 8 years are going to be very long and difficult for you, Sir.

24:

the state only said he cert was on file, it didn't say he was born there

Right. That's why the report said this:

State officials say there's no doubt Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.

By the way, the birth certificate can be seen here. Better check the kerning. More on this subject here.

Under HI law, those who are born outside HI but whose parents live there can get certs

Really? Prove it.

This and the following post by Lindgren are idiotic. The SDS had chapters at lots of colleges in the 60s when Obama was a child and this company's connection with the SDS, which is hardly remarkable, also occurred when Obama was a child.

I work by choice at a college that was involved in a famous desegregation case. Does that mean they hired me because I'm white?

Hi -

I'm sorry, Prof. Lindgren, that you haven't gotten a lot of response to your request although I agree with the (milder) comments that your post wasn't particularly well written if your intent was to garner thoughtful responses.

You've written elsewhere that you've probably voted for Obama in the past more often than anyone else on this blog. Could you say a little more about that? Usually researching candidates and learning about their connections is easier at the local level than at the national. When I was involved in local politics in Ft. Wayne, IN I had a basic knowledge of the inter-relationships and backgrounds of the major players, although I was minor in the extreme. What kind of due diligence did you perform previous to Obama's presidential candidacy? Did none of these kinds of issues arise in the local context?

jukeboxgrad: this thread is supposed to be about what's stated above. However, this post and the link following "state law linked from here" explain everything for you. The AP report above was apparently jumping to a conclusion, assuming that if his cert is on file then he was born there. That's a false conclusion. See the link and what it links to; everything is not as settled as "fact checkers" would have you believe.

However, any further discussion can be had by leaving a comment at my link, and I urge everyone not to waste time on this issue but instead do something effective.

CiarandDenlane:

Here I am, a genuinely undecided voter (barely leaning Obama last week, barely leaning McCain yesterday, back to Obama today, who knows Tuesday) in a swing state, clicking on a link that requests information, and instead of information I find boomerang snark and vitriol. Can y'all let those of us who actually are so stupid or congenitally indecisive that we want to know how the chicken was prepared read the menu notes in peace?

There is another post where the comment section is turned off, but a link states that comments should be left here. That is probably why the comments seem out of place. They make little sense without reading the other post.

Critical thinking is not a strong skill for the followers of the "Chicago Dope".

Obama was just unlucky to keep turning up in the same law firms, neighborhoods, businesses and schools as this bunch of crazy American-hating loons such as the mumbers of the SDS. So Obama and Michele interned at the same law firm as William Ayers wife, Bernadine Doern, coincidence. It is just a coincidence that Obama and Ayers lived on the same block while Obama attended college then by a miracle William Ayers ends up 15 years later living two houses down from Obama in a neighborhood 1500 miles away from Boston. And that was after Obama got selected, a young inexperienced know-nothing, to head Ayers 155 million dollar debacle where Obama failed miserably.

Obama has to be the most unlucky man alive to keep getting followed by these crazy loons everywhere he goes. I mean who wants to be followed around by a group of people like Ayers, Doern, and Klonsky who planted bombs in schools, police offices and dance halls, seriously planned for re-education camps in the Western states and the need to exterminate upto 25 million Americans who wouldn't renounce capitalism. Doern and Ayers especially loved Charles Manson after he sent his followers on the drug-crazed murder spree in California. They advised their followers to start the revolution by going home and murdering their parents. Obama hangs with some freaky people, but surely doesn't like them or anything. I guess he stays centered by his "faith",....Opps, sorry about that.

Obama says he was going to these people to get opposing viewpoints, but can any of this -bots please provide the list of people Obama went to for his non-Soviet views?

Two things stand out about Obama:
1) After the collapse of the Soviet Union showed the utter failure of communism, why in the h*ll was Obama and these "intellectual" morons still agitating for this policy disaster?
2) Do his supporters not care that Obama flat out lied in front of Hillary during their debate when he said that William Ayers was "just a guy in the neighborhood"? What do you make of that lie? Obama must have known that Ayers was toxic or he wouldn't have felt the need to misdirect his lovers in that debate?

I almost summered for Sidley Austin. Thank goodness I turned that down. I was so naive, I did not know that it was just a front for a 60's radical conspiracy to destroy America.

Lindgren, apparently you hit a nerve. Lots of hysterical reaction from the Obots above, mostly along the typical dismissive oh that's just some weird coincidence you get when murder suspects try to explain away the gun in their car, or the prissy threats this blog sucks, I'm just going to take my eyeballs and go home so beloved among intellectual fascists.

I find it (your observation) a small note of distaste added to Obama the man. The SDS were a bunch of narcissist fuckpigs and Bernadine Dohrn was, and maybe still is, an antisocial inhuman wretch. You'd have to have a strong stomach to come within 10 miles of them and their associates. It's not unlike someone volunteering to do legal work for the Aryan Nation, or become friends with someone who, in the 60s, advocated sterilizing the unfit. Blech.

GMCG
Can't redirect that your candidate grew up and embraced the people who to this day have no qualms about their activities, only that they weren't successful. They openly admit that they they are still believers and have only changed tactics, not goals. Ayers was in Venezuela just last year praising Chavez and his use of education programs to forment "revolution". Rational people know that Marxism\Socialism\Communism is a disaster, history has proven it but if what you say is true, that what they advanced is not a live enemy, then why are they still agitating for it and why does Obama use the same words and methods and promote the same ideas? Tax justice, civilian security force, spread the wealth.

And Obama has been right there at every turn. An amazing bit of bad luck for Obama, don't you think.

Vote for Obama if you must, but be honest about what you are voting to implement.

It is hard to imagine a republican with similar associations, coincidental or not, getting by with such little concern.
Look at Reagan: Still hammered for being racist because he gave a speech at a fair in Mississippi which was near a place some civil rights had been violated.
Now, suppose we had Reagan rooming with Bull Connor in the service, or as a youngster working with George Wallace on a welfare program.
Think he'd be get the same pass the One is getting?

Many of Obama's supporters know exactly what they're doing. But they know the rest of us wouldn't like it. So they lie, dissemble, pretend certain issues are off limits.

I drop in at Volokh every now and then. When did it turn into a forum for Obama supporters to attack any comment they don't like?

People are getting close to The Truth, but they need a few more links to have everything revealed. I would suggest that anyone who wants to know about the real Barack HUSSEIN Obama should explore his links to the Eye of Providence and the Argenteum Astrum. If you are really lucky you can get a reporter ask Obama about the Golden Apple. If Obama does not answer the question and then leaves the room, you will know you are on to something.

Now, suppose we had Reagan rooming with Bull Connor in the service, or as a youngster working with George Wallace on a welfare program. Think he'd be get the same pass the One is getting?

Reagan once visited a cemetary with some dead SS soldiers. I won't even attempt to describe the tumult that ensued.

"Of all the firms in all the world, Obama had to walk into the one..."

How come nobody caught the reference to Bogart's first line to Ingrid Bergman in Casablanca, "Of all the lousy gin-joints in the world, you had to walk into this one...?"

I just got invited by my next-door neighbors, academic bien-pensants of the finest order, to hang out with them, and a crowd of like-minded Obamazoids, Tuesday evening to watch the pre-coronation of The One. Of course I accepted, "til the fat lady sings and all.

There's a great Australian movie from the late 1970s, directed by Bruce Bereford, about exactly the preferred outcome of such an invitation, called "Don's Party". Go Google it.

The sole non-lefty couple there, however, are total complete dorks. Unhip beyond imagination. Maybe I'm that too now. What else could explain it, except maybe a cerebral infarction?

The Oz Labor Party proceeds to lose the election. Everybody goes berserk. Based on a true-life adventure (1969).

Those who read the VC regularly know my general views--and they are not pro-Obama.

That said, this is one of the stranger posts I have read. How Obama's first job out of Columbia is relevant to much of anything is a mystery to me. That his employer may have some kind of tenuous tie with SDS is irrelevant.

I don't usually snark at authors here, but lordy. This is getting into Pam "Atlas shrugs" whatsherface territory (She of the "Obama was Malcom X's lovechild and really born in Canada" fame). I'm not sure it would even fly at some of the saner edgy Republican leaning partisan blogs. And that's saying something, as even the ones I like are getting pretty nutty.

Chapman,

"any comments the question the validity of Prof. Lindgren's reasoning"

Still waiting for one of those. I might be waiting a long time, since Lindgren doesn't offer any reasoning or even an argument in his post. It's just (another) data point.

Pretty clear by now that Obama is from the left. The more interesting question is where he's to. I like the trajectory as I see it.

To me the most astonishing issue right NOW, 36 freaking hours before the election, is that we're talking about these issues at all. This post should have occurred say, oh, one year ago, when this unknown freshman Senator was running for his party's nomination. I'm sure all this time the press thought they were doing the right thing on some level when they decided to run interference for Obama, but I think the fullness of time is going to demonstrate the opposite. Just because the man's elected doesn't mean any of these issues are going to go away. Once the mission is accomplished and Obama is in the Oval Office, the main imperative driving the mainstream media's silence and incuriosity about him will be gone. At some point the press will succumb to competitive pressures to sell papers and commercial air=time and revert to being the press again. What's going to happen when the "guy who lives in my neighborhood" turns out to have helped Obama write Dreams from my Father? What's going to happen when it becomes known that Obama collected more money from illegal campaign donations than McCain raised in total donations? What's going to happen when it's revealed that Obama attended Columbia under some embarrassing affirmative action criteria, or that he didn't actually attend Columbia at all? What if what little has been discovered about Senator Obama is merely the tip of the iceberg in terms of creepy political associations or, God forbid, illegal behavior? Then what?

Keep in mind that I'm not arguing that any of these rumors or suspicions turns out to be true or untrue, or even that I believe they're true or untrue, and that's because in all honesty I have no idea. My complaint is that due to the mainstream media's self-dealing partisanship, none of us has any idea. We are going to elect a man President of the United States who right now remains 90% unvetted.

yours/
peter.

When the n is consistently this low

The n can be surprisingly low depending on the network. I'm currently working with a company where one of the principals used to work for a company that I previously worked at (we never met before this project). That principal knows a very good friend of mine because they went to the same university. A company that shares the office space is working with a different company I did contract work for on a completely unrelated technology.

Then there was the time a former coworker from a company I was at a decade ago was working with the ex-girlfriend of the best man at my wedding. This was a link that went from the southwest to the west coast, back to the east coast.

I'd suggest reading up on small world networks if this sort of thing intrigues you. iirc, you can connect just about anyone in the world to anyone else in less than 6 steps. This number greatly decreases when you get into professional networks.

When the n is consistently this low, I'm not sure that shout downs are the optimal response, and I doubt that revulsion is the most relevant emotion about which to be concerned.

Mr. Warner, I'd hardly consider a gap of two decades with who knows how much turnover "low."

Loved you in Time Bandits, by the way.

Excuse me, personnel turnover. Got a bit trigger-happy with the ctrl-backspace there. And to further clarify things, what's going on here isn't a "shout-down." No one's trying to drown you out, or forcibly exclude you from the discussion. No, this is just good old-fashioned ridicule.

My compliment still stands, however. And what about that part where the top of your head unhinges and a little saw comes out? Can you do that in real life or was that just a special effect? PLEASE, I MUST KNOW

logical:

So Obama and Michele interned at the same law firm as William Ayers wife, Bernadine Doern, coincidence.

The fact that Dohrn worked there only tends to underline the fact that Ayers and Dohrn are now mainstream. Here are some facts about Sidley Austin:

Sidley Austin LLP … is one of the oldest law firms in the world. It is the sixth-largest U.S.-based corporate law firm with over 1,800 lawyers, annual revenues of more than one billion dollars, and offices in 16 cities worldwide… Its original predecessor firm was founded in 1866 and had Mary Todd Lincoln, the widow of President Abraham Lincoln, among its earliest clients.… As of 2006, it was the 9th largest law firm in the world (and 5th in the US) by revenue.

Not the kind of outfit that is likely to pal around with terrorists.

people like Ayers, Doern, and Klonsky who planted bombs in schools, police offices and dance halls

Show your proof that WUO ever planted bombs in "schools" or "dance halls."
--------------------------------------------------
aubrey:

It is hard to imagine a republican with similar associations, coincidental or not, getting by with such little concern.

McCain's friend Liddy was involved in multiple murder plots. IOKIYAR.
------------------------------
24:

BHO was 19 when the Weathermen killed three people: two cops and a security guard.

Show your proof.
---------------------------------------
pc:

Salem bin Laden, brother of Osama bin Laden, invested in Arbusto Energy when George W. Bush ran Arbusto.

And Pappy Bush was in a meeting with another bin Laden brother the morning of 9/11. In New York.

rsh:

one- three ex-Weathermen

Exactly. The key part is "ex."

And if one of those guys does something bad tomorrow, that will be Obama's fault, too.

RSH,

"Loved you in Time Bandits, by the way"

The closing credits put an appropriate cap on what was a singularly surreal experience for a ten-year-old.

Ridicule, shout down, whatever. I don't think that's a promising way to govern, unless you want to end up with Bush III. As much as I hate Dale Carnegie, he'd be a step up from the current political culture.

What's going to happen when it's revealed that Obama attended Columbia under some embarrassing affirmative action criteria, or that he didn't actually attend Columbia at all?

What? What did you just say? Again, if any of the sane administrators on this blog read these comments, could you give some consideration to revoking Lindgren and Zywicki's blogging privilges until Election Day? Your reputation just goes down the drain with stuff like this.

With all of the talk abot both Obama's connections with th eradical leftist law firm Sidley &Austin, why hasn't anyone raised the 9/11 connection? It's a well known fact that Sidley &Austin's office in the World Trade Center was destroyed on 9/11. Almost as well known is tha the firm didn't need the space, which had come from he merger with Brown &Wood, since the mid-town office had enough room for the New York branch at that point in the 2001 recession. If fact, it's entirely plausible that the firm saved more on rent than the cost of the entire terror operation (estimated at a few hundred thousand dollars by the 9/11 commission). Is it irresponsible to investigate whether the firm put a former Summer associate, who NOT ONLY lived within two blocks of two known former terrorists, BUT ALSO had once been employed by a company that two decades earlier had connections to some non-violent demonstrators some of whom were friends of friends of violent deomnstrators, in charge of an operation to profit from a large-scale terror atack? It would be irresponsible not to. But the MSM hasn't even looked at it.

Jeffersonian:
Ref Reagan and the Bitburg (I think) cemetery.
I am not aware of whether it is possible to go to a German WW II cemetery and not find some of the Waffen SS buried there. Despite their reputation, there weren't all that many of them compared to the Wehrmacht. So it's possible that a small cemetery might not have any Waffen SS interred there.
But not, absent some kind of formal arrangement, guaranteed.
So, presuming that Reagan went to a cemetery which was logistically available for a presidential visit and all that, the likelihood is there would have been SS guys there. The problem was that his handlers said he should find another place and he refused, and then gave a speech about how these guys are victims of the war, too. That might have been okay with Wehremacht guys. But, considering the enthusiasm with which the Schutzstaffeln (sp) threw themselves into their work, that piece didn't fly with a lot of folks. Now, I fully believe that the press would have tried to flay Reagan if he'd said nothing, or said something more appropriate. But republicans should remember that, although the press and the libs are going to misrepresent everything they say and mean, you may as well make them work for it and not give them a handy lever.
Many of the occupied countries generated enough SS recruits to come up with their very own SS divisions, Viking, Nordland, Charlemagne, and some others. So it would follow that those nations now would rather say mean things about an American president than recall some uncomfortable things about themselves.

Keep in mind that I'm not arguing that any of these rumors or suspicions turns out to be true or untrue, or even that I believe they're true or untrue, and that's because in all honesty I have no idea. My complaint is that due to the mainstream media's self-dealing partisanship, none of us has any idea.

You mean the media is partisan because they don't print unfounded fever-swamp rumors about Obama? Do you think they should chase down every fantasy that some blogger dreams up?

You mean the media is partisan because they don't print unfounded fever-swamp rumors about Obama? Do you think they should chase down every fantasy that some blogger dreams up?

The problem with trying to knock down conspiracy theories is the people that create the theories tend to cling to them tightly. No amount of evidence will be good enough to prove the theory wrong. I was just listening to an interview with Philip J. Berg, the guy that filed the law suit over Obama's birth certificate.

Hawaiian officials came out recently and said they confirmed Obama's birth certificate. His new argument? The officials didn't specifically say they confirmed his "Hawaiian birth certificate." The officials may have confirmed his Kenyan birth certificate.

If the officials came out and said, "we have confirmed Barack Obama was born in Hawaii and his Hawaiian birth certificate is genuine," then some other conspiracy would be offered. Obama threatened the officials, paid them off, etc. There's no way to win that argument.

When dealing people that like to peddle conspiracy theories there are two options. Ignore them and hope they go away or mock them. I find the latter is more entertaining.

hughes is dead

all you have is speculation and lies

byomotov

Yeah. To pull some rank, so to speak. I spent a couple of summers in MS doing the civil rights thing, so I am more aware than most about the sorts of things that happened.
However, other things go on as well. Where I worked, there was a black sheriff by 1986, who had to have been somebody long enough prior to that to be a viable candidate. One thing he had been was a coroner who busted a couple of cops who killed a black prisoner, and thereby started the Byhalia boycott. See Osborne Bell.
The problem with Reagan and the county fair issue is that any republican who goes to a county fair in a county were something bad happened (certain things. The death of Kenneth Tillery certainly wouldn't have counted) within a certain--lengthy and flexible--period of time is going to give libs, dems, and the media a handle for completely unsupported smears. Goes with the territory.
Nobody has a problem with states' rights, I hope, on a board for lawyers. I hope.
It was code for one thing in the Fifties and Sixties, it's straightforward other things now. And it was when Reagan talked about it.

I stand corrected, eyesay!

In case no one else answered the "challenge", the WUO or a splinter group did kill three people when BHO was just 19 years old, when the toddler BHO was barely able to speak or walk:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weatherman_(organization)#Dissolution

Certain members remained underground and joined other radical groups. Years after the dissolution of the WUO, former members Kathy Boudin, Judith Alice Clark, and David Gilbert formed the May 19 Communist Organization, which eventually joined with the Black Liberation Army. On October 20, 1981, in Nyack New York, the group robbed a Brinks armored truck containing $1.6 million. The robbery turned violent, resulting in the murders of two police officers and a security guard.[6] Boudin, Clark, and Gilbert were found guilty and sentenced to lengthy terms in prison, considered the “last gasps” of the Weather Underground.

Dohrn served several months in jail over that.

Also, regarding the birth certificate, it's a fact that Obama has not proved that he's eligible, despite what the "fact checkers" have said. And, no, the recent report from the state of HI isn't proof either. They only said they had a cert on file, they provided absolutely no information on that cert. Under HI state law (at the link), those who weren't born in HI can get a HI birth certificate.

Visitor.
Rosenberg alledgely drove the getaway car. But was never prosecuted.
In your mind, does the latter mean she had nothing to do with it?
I know not being prosecuted, or, as happened with Ayers, being prosecuted with tainted information is a get out of jail free card. But is that the same as having not actually been involved?

By.
Okay, I was dismissive of the nature of the offense.
Counties are big, MS is a poor agricultural state and is overrun with kudzu because they were even poor at agriculture. If you want to speak at a county fair on or about such and such a date, you don't have much of a choice.
The murders had been some years earlier.

To make a comparison: If Jesse Jackson went to Wichita and spoke about how the criminal justice system is unfair to black men, would he be considered to be affirming the Wichita Massacre?
Of course not.
What if he didn't speak about anything having to do with crime at all?
It's a stretch reserved for republicans.