The Right Experience for a Supreme Court Justice:
I've been thinking about what kind of experience is helpful for a Supreme Court nominee. I have come up with the ideal experience the President should seek.

  First, it would be very helpful for the candidate to have a science background, all the better a Ph.D. After she gets her Ph.D., she should spend a few years volunteering to help the poor to get a better sense of poverty in our society. She should then go to law school. After law school, she should clerk for a magistrate judge, a bankruptcy judge, a district court judge, a court of appeals judge, and a Supreme Court Justice. That way, the nominee will have a good sense of what it's like at all stages of the federal court system.

  The candidate should then have considerable practice experience. In particular, the candidate should spend at least 5 years at a large law firm, followed by 5 years as a solo practitioner. That way she'll really understand legal practice. But that practice would be mostly civil law, and Supreme Court Justices also deal a lot with criminal law. The candidate should therefore get experience as a state prosecutor and then experience as a federal prosecutor. After that, the candidate should obtain experience in criminal defense, by spending a few years as public defender in the state system and a few years as a public defender in the federal system.

  Of course, at this point the candidate won't have any Supreme Court experience, and that would be very helpful for a prospective Justice. So I would want the candidate to spend a few years as an Assistant at the SG's Office to understand Supreme Court practice. I think it would also be helpful for the candidate to get experience understanding the executive branch, so I want the candidate to then spend a few years at the Office of Legal Counsel and at least a year in the White House Counsel's office. Experience in Congress is very helpful, too, and a few years as counsel to the Senate Judiciary Committee would be an excellent way to get that.

  Next the candidate needs prior judicial experience. The ideal candidate would have a few years of experience as a state trial judge, followed by a few years of experience as a state appellate judge. That way the judge understand law "in the trenches", and also understand the importance of state courts. Next, the candidate should get experience as a federal judge, too. Ideally, the candidate would be a federal trial judge for a few years and a federal court of appeals judge for a few years.

  There's only one more stage at this point: The ideal candidate would have a sense of the political system. We don't need Justices who are pointy-headed beancounters; someone with political experience would be great. In particular, I'd like to see a candidate who served a few years in the state legislature, followed by a few years in the House of Representatives and a term or two in the Senate. It would also be great for the candidate to then have a few Presidential runs and perhaps end up on a national ticket. A term as President or even just VP would be ideal, but then that may be asking too much.

  At this point the candidate would be about 147 years old, an much of her relevant experience would be outdated. The science Ph.D. would be about 120 years past, and the world of legal practice she experienced as as lawyer would be a century outdated. So I would want her to do it again, except this time super-quickly, like a month per job or something, to get a good refresher on things.

  By then there will be a magic pill you can take that can make you any age you want, so we would give her that pill and make our 153 year old Justice a very youthful 32 years old. And that 32 year-old would be the perfect Supreme Court nominee.
Uh_Clem (mail):
You could have just written "the perfect is the enemy of the good" and saved a lot of typing.
5.7.2009 4:04pm
Middle Name Ralph:
You left off military experience . But, maybe that would be asking too much?
5.7.2009 4:05pm
DJ (mail):
Say, you've come pretty close to describing the background and training of Carolyn Kuhl!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carolyn_Kuhl

Except, er, she never did get any experience as a federal court of appeals judge.
5.7.2009 4:08pm
AF:
I'm in!
5.7.2009 4:10pm
David Welker (www):
I agree with Middle Name Ralph. Supreme Court Justices do make decisions with national security implications upon occasion.

But, though I know this an attempt at satire, in fact many of the experiences you mention would in fact be helpful to a justice. Also, I think many of the experiences would clearly overlap in terms of skill-set to a greater or lesser degree. Once someone has acquired basic skills, they would need less time in the later jobs. (Whether anyone would want to hire them to spend less time in the later jobs is obviously an entirely different question. Indeed, anyone evaluating such a candidate may very well question whether such applicant is willing to commit himself or herself to anything for very long...)

Obviously, your point is made. There is no "perfect" candidate for the Supreme Court. But, you don't want to take this point too far either. It is perfectly valid to want Supreme Court justices to bring different experiences and perspectives together, and maybe we don't want them to be too homogeneous. Just because we can't have one perfect justice, that doesn't mean that we wouldn't benefit from a Supreme Court where the justices, as a group, have a diversity of experiences that they bring to discussions.
5.7.2009 4:11pm
Prosecutorial Indiscretion:
Your point is well-taken. That said, wanting the Court to involve a breadth of experience does not mean every justice has to have a ridiculously broad background. It just means that, e.g., having one justice who's spent time in the trenches would be nice, so that the Court as a whole would have the benefit of that perspective and experience. Nine justices with antitrust experience would be a bit pointless; one or two seems pretty useful.
5.7.2009 4:11pm
JoelP:
A great deal of the required time may be knocked off by removing the counterproductive legal training/experience. Assuming we want our laws to be comprehensible to the layman, it would be helpful to have fewer judges with law degrees.

I was with you on the science degree though.
5.7.2009 4:15pm
Gabriel McCall (mail):
And that 32 year-old would be the perfect Supreme Court nominee.

...if the Supreme Court only consisted of a single judge. Instead, how about we divide that up into ninths, and suggest that each of the justices on the Court should have maybe one or two sections thereof?
5.7.2009 4:15pm
blabla:
You know a serious post by you on this issue would have been interesting.
5.7.2009 4:17pm
Just an Observer:
There is no constitutional requirement that a justice be a lawyer at all. Since the court is already lawyer-heavy, maybe that element could be trimmed from Orin's specifications. (An even more diverse selection might be a disbarred lawyer. Or an impeached judge with political savvy, such as Alcee Hastings.)
5.7.2009 4:18pm
Anderson (mail):
Prof. Kerr forgot that the ideal justice would also have altered his or her skin color, apparent gender, and sexual preference(s) to various hues, sexes, and orientations over time, so as to properly experience the vicissitudes of each, the better to issue suitably empathetic rulings when he or she eventually, and a tad wearily it seems, ascends to the bench.

S/he should also blog, and leave comment threads on, the better to grasp and implement the views of the blogosphere.
5.7.2009 4:22pm
rosetta's stones:

...someone with political experience would be great.


Why?

Most of what you have here are nice bullet points for things to look for and weigh, but "political" experience isn't a qualifier for a judge now, nor should it be, imo. If they have some, fine, but no need to weight this above anything else, if at all.
.
.

Better to know how they play the pick-and-roll, for the SC rec league games. And with Souter gone, they need some outside shooting.
5.7.2009 4:25pm
Steven Lubet (mail):
Cute post, but it obscures a meaningful point about the similarity of the current justices' backgrounds.

Still, if you divide 147 by 9, each justice would only need about 16 years of experience, but in the aggregate they could have all or most of the experiences Orin describes. On a collegial court, varied backgrounds would be helpful.
5.7.2009 4:26pm
MarkField (mail):
But would we even then accept the result if she told us those were only shadows on the cave wall?
5.7.2009 4:28pm
Anon321:
And of course spent time in legal acadmia, wherein she would have had the opportunity to think deeply about the state of the law at a remove from the nitty-gritty realities of day-to-day legal practice. Ideally, she would have established herself as a prolific scholar and recognized expert in the fields of constitutional, criminal, administrative, antitrust, tax, and bankruptcy law, at a minimum. In so doing, she would have developed a singular, incisive prose style and a capacity for generating original lines that will be remembered generations hence.
5.7.2009 4:30pm
Mikee (mail):
How about somebody who thinks the words of the Constitution have meaning, limiting the power of the federal government; that the laws passed by federal and state legislatures must adhere to the limitations of power contained in the Constitution; and that unconstitutional use of power by the government should be curtailed whenever it occurs?

That doesn't take years of experience, just ability to read English using dictionary definitions.

Who am I kidding - your method of finding a good justice is more likely to work.
5.7.2009 4:30pm
Blar (mail) (www):
Really, the only experience that can prepare you to be a Supreme Court Justice is to serve on the Supreme Court. That's why I'd be hesitant to confirm any nominee who hasn't spent at least 3 years as a Supreme Court Justice.
5.7.2009 4:32pm
Paul Horwitz:
I agree with Mikee's comment, but I see two problems with it: 1) I can think of no sitting judge or Justice who disagrees with any of the propositions he advances, so I don't see it as doing much winnowing work; and 2) his second sentence in no way follows as a matter of necessity from his first sentence. Also, he doesn't make clear which dictionary he's talking about; a modern dictionary, a dictionary dating to 1789 (or 1868), or a [modern or ancient] law dictionary.
5.7.2009 4:37pm
NaG (mail):
It should go to the runner-up for this season's American Idol.
5.7.2009 4:39pm
Javert:
Or she could just stay at a Holiday Inn Express.
5.7.2009 4:39pm
dmv:
Subtle Holiday Inn Express trolling above.

Kerr's candidate would be wholly unacceptable to me. No international human rights experience. For shame, Kerr, for shame.
5.7.2009 4:41pm
Anderson (mail):
It should go to the runner-up for this season's American Idol.

Let's have our own show: Judicial Idol!

Also, I think that the ideal candidate would take some time out and just walk the earth ... you know, walk the earth, meet people, get into adventures. Like Caine from Kung Fu.
5.7.2009 4:47pm
D.O.:
I am sorry, but the discussion is kind of boring. Can we ask Prof. Kerr please to post something more energizing?
5.7.2009 4:49pm
Redman:
Practicing lawyer, state judge, state attorney general, state supreme court justice, US senator. ???
5.7.2009 4:52pm
Joseph Slater (mail):
And in all this experience, probably best not to have written anything -- even as a college student -- that expresses anything like an opinion on anything like a controversial subject.
5.7.2009 4:56pm
DJ (mail):
Yup. John Cornyn.
5.7.2009 5:03pm
PlugInMonster:
Nothing about Judge Bybee, torture, Condi's warmongering, torture? Air America, torture? More torture? War crimes....
5.7.2009 5:05pm
MJH21 (mail):
And she should go to community college first (real life experience to empathize with the less tawny), then a private girls only college (to understand the unique educational institutional insight which justifies colleges discriminating on the basis of gender), then to a state law school - we don't need any more Ivy leaguers.
5.7.2009 5:07pm
Carl the EconGuy (mail):
How about somebody bland, faceless, inexperienced, indecisive, with no record whatsoever, and preferably from a small rural state with no minorities? Oh wait, we just did that, right? Well, since that wasn't such a great idea, why not a screaming lefty who'll support Obama's class warfare all the way instead? Yeah, that could work.
5.7.2009 5:08pm
Splunge:
Actually, she -- if we really are talking about a woman specifically and not just being cutesy PC about our pronouns -- could probably just raise four children from birth through college and have all the broad practical experience that any reasonable person could want.

Of course, after that 20 years I very much doubt she'd want another job almost as strenuous.
5.7.2009 5:08pm
Mark in Colorado:
Why not include some experience as a felon? The candidate would have experience with the corrections system and might hold more empathy for the accused.
5.7.2009 5:10pm
TK75:
This post, while cute, betrays the bias of the legal academy. Nowhere in your laundry list of requirements is there even a hint of business or commercial experience.

What this country needs more than ever before is a justice with a background in transactional practice. How about elevating someone from the Delaware bankruptcy courts? The bias in the legal world against transactional attorneys is long overdue for change...

I think if we had people with backgrounds in patent/IP and bankruptcy as our next 2 justices, we would be in great shape.
5.7.2009 5:12pm
einhverfr (mail) (www):
I hereby suggest that I, with no real legal experience, would be a great candidate for Supreme Court justice. I am interested in a wide variety of topics, take my time to research issues, believe in the stability of the law, and in judicial restraint.

I also promise that if nominated, I will become the second Supreme Court justice in history to attend law school after being nominated!
5.7.2009 5:14pm
krs:
Anderson writes:

Prof. Kerr forgot that the ideal justice would also have altered his or her skin color, apparent gender, and sexual preference(s) to various hues, sexes, and orientations over time, so as to properly experience the vicissitudes of each, the better to issue suitably empathetic rulings when he or she eventually, and a tad wearily it seems, ascends to the bench.



And Mark in Colorado writes:

Why not include some experience as a felon? The candidate would have experience with the corrections system and might hold more empathy for the accused



Those are my two favorites. The nominee should also have some experience with foreign legal systems (but not too much), should have some experience being poor, broke, addicted to drugs, and disabled.

And of course there's the always indispensable Maryland perspective on the law.
5.7.2009 5:18pm
Loophole1998 (mail):
I think experience is overrated. (Fire away.) The only job of a justice is to discern and communicate the written law. To the extent experience helps one accomplish these tasks, fine, but a person's point of view based on life experience should in no way substantively inform their vote.
5.7.2009 5:19pm
Apep (mail):
To be a justice, you need only meet three requirements:

(1) Be a mammal.
(2) Fight all the time.
(3) Flip out and kill people.
5.7.2009 5:25pm
Anderson (mail):
That is some memory there, krs.

I believe there was at one time a Mississippi perspective on certain issues of constitutional law, but those were resolved in Grant v. Lee, an 1865 decision.
5.7.2009 5:29pm
MarkField (mail):
The ideal candidate is obviously Chuck Norris.
5.7.2009 5:30pm
Joseph Slater (mail):
Apep:

Ninja Justice!!!
5.7.2009 5:35pm
George Smith:
The only nominee criteria that will count is "empathy."
5.7.2009 5:48pm
pjohnson (mail):
Query, if she magically became 32 years old again, then did she actually have any of the experience she had between ages 32 and 153?
5.7.2009 5:48pm
Calderon:
TK75 said:


I think if we had people with backgrounds in patent/IP and bankruptcy as our next 2 justices, we would be in great shape.


Lies, slander, and calumny. What the Supreme Court really needs is justices with a background in constitutioanl law. Tradition over diversity!

On a slightly more serious, the judge who I clerked shares your view, that the bench as a whole really needs more judges experienced in business and commercial matters. His belief was that too many judges had either been prosecutors or other positions where they had worked for the government such as agencies (he himself had been a prosecutor). I agree that having a Justice with that experience would be valuable, but I doubt with this particular President and in these particular times that the nominee will have much familiarity with business and commercial practice.
5.7.2009 5:54pm
Desiderius:
Perhaps an experience point system of some sort would serve your purpose. Blizzard could help you put one together.
5.7.2009 6:04pm
geokstr (mail):
Let it be known to all that I agree with MarkField 100% on his comment.

There, see how you like it.

:-)
5.7.2009 6:04pm
Mike D:
Well, how about associate in private practice (civil); Assistant AG for a state, with a lot of criminal work; AG; state trial lawyer; state supreme court justice; and fed appellate justice. Well-rounded enough? His name is David Souter.
5.7.2009 6:14pm
Just an Observer:
PlugInMonster: Nothing about Judge Bybee, torture ...

What an inspired suggestion!

There could be a scenario in which Bybee would offer an almost perfect diversity nominee, who also would let Obama cover his political flank by "looking forward, not backward" regarding torture, unbridled executive war powers, etc. --

Bybee resigns from the bench and surrenders his law license. Obama pardons Bybee for any possible conspiracy charge and nominates him for SCOTUS.

Bybee even has the empathy patter down cold:

"Talk is cheap. There's a difference between the theoretical discussion of the law and its practice. I take very seriously the fact that I have people's economic interests, liberty, and very lives in my hands."
—Reflecting on his appointment to the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals. ...

"I would like my headstone to read, 'He always tried to do the right thing.'"


The only problem is that Bybee is the wrong gender.
5.7.2009 6:41pm
markm (mail):
We could definitely use a couple of justices that spent twenty years in prison, preferably on death row, before DNA testing exonerated them. But they would have to be appointed and confirmed by some of the same people their decisions would place limitations on...

As for the effect of background, I vaguely remember a case concerning cross-burning where Thomas apparently convinced several of his colleagues. Cross-burning is indeed symbolic speech, but any reasonable black person who grew up in the USA would read the message as, "Nigger, we're going to get you." I'm a first amendment absolutist, but direct threats are not and should not be protected.
5.7.2009 7:42pm
Anderson (mail):
The only problem is that Bybee is the wrong gender.

That can be corrected.
5.7.2009 7:51pm
jbarntt:
Hard to find prof. Kerr's perfect candidate, but since he would be around 150 years old, I say go for Alexander Hamilton. Sure he'd be about 252 years old, but what's a century here or there ?

Meets a lot of requirements:

NY legislature
Continental Congress
Military
Executive branch experience
State and SCOTUS appellate practice

Lack of any college degree, other than honorary, means common touch. Being an immigrant means sensitivity to immigrants. Is sometimes accused of having been a homosexual, which might help counter that he was a man, but as noted above, even that can be fixed.

Problems with the nomination, and possible solutions:

Never served as a judge: Experience in Philadelphia 1787 and in the NY ratifying convention could be considered a substitute. Writings often cited in SCOTUS decisions, and even quoted or at least paraphrased in McCulloch v. Maryland.

Lastly, there is a much under represented, and maligned, minority w/o any power in our government, and a Hamilton nomination would at least help in this regard. I refer to zombies, as of course a resurrected Hamilton would qualify under federal guidelines.

In short, Hamilton is probably the best we can find for Obama. I will look forward to the oral arguments:

Hamilton: "Counselor, you are a very brainy fellow, why don't you come to my chambers when we are done, I'd like to have you over for lunch. Brainzzzzz !"
5.7.2009 11:42pm
Middle Name Ralph:

That can be corrected.


And, according to Bybee, not torture even if done involuntarily.
5.7.2009 11:46pm
jbarntt:
And, according to Bybee, not torture even if done involuntarily.

Naturally, as gender is an artificial construct. As long as surgery is done painlessly, I see no problem. Only a bigot would object to gender reassignment. I hope you aren't arguing that such surgery is torture, as we would then need to stop it altogether.

Of course yours is a straw man argument, as Bybee never advocated what you say he did. If I am wrong, please give me a cite.
5.8.2009 12:16am
trad and anon (mail):
I think you forgot to mention that the ideal candidate would also have experience running a small business, preferably a pony farm.
5.8.2009 3:25am
David M. Nieporent (www):
I get the sense that Orin likes this proposal mostly because, well, think of all the beers one would owe Orin after having been alive for 140 years.
5.8.2009 9:15am
Law Student (mail):
We could just nominate Posner and end all this talk of who is, or is not, qualified. Unfortunately, politics will get in the way of choosing the best man for the job.
5.8.2009 9:37am
MartyA:
Interesting. But, as I read your experience line, I couldn't help but wonder about the salary associated with each activity. What kind of money do those jobs pay?
Who is supporting her while she earns her Ph.D. and in the early years of volunteering.
Would she marry and have children? If married, would her husband be able to profit by selling her influence or, at minimum, be able to send some earmark money her way? How about cattle futures? How about if she were a Republican?
5.8.2009 12:33pm

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